關於英基的質疑（來自英基家長）

lui

原帖由 samsam123321 於 14-11-10 發表
咁樣講，計百分比，每年有20幾%gcse a 星，又是non elective,成績已算英國私校的前列。同全港其他出名成績 ...

討論先不以debenture or school fee 為目標。
前文家長提到好多underperformed,入野雞、入不到大學。好多是什麼意思？英基每年千多位畢業生，以人數或是%計有很多？有學生入不到大學是正常，反正學校是non selective .香港local school 好中學入大學%也只是60-70%（不是DGS, SPCC).不過esf 家長可能有能力送外國讀書，所以大學率應該高於此%.我阿女也在ESFjunior secondary ，剛入.如果擔心㡳打不好，我估只有入傳統local school先穩陣。所以細女我也未decide 定入local school 定IS.不過我見幾多ESF學生也是表現不錯iB分數不差(36-38）.也沒有什麼補習。

elmostoney

samsam123321 發表於 14-11-10 12:34
數學方面，你可以話佢地跟本唔同Ls咁教法。佢地跟本係唔操練!所以計數肯定係差。都係果句，你入去前已知道 ...

入左都可以批評掛? esf教數最大问题唔係操練咁簡單，係老師兼顧唔到咁大班，而程度的variance咁大。esf吸引我係因有中学，相对易入，好近我家。因我大女係其他IS讀，我当然会拿兩者比較。我唔轉埋2個一齐主因係大女学校冇中学。

samsam123321

跟本佢地對教學目標的concept都唔同， 大部分香港人係以成績為目標。所以要操練。佢地只教你想，無練習課本，你家長覺得唔夠咪自己買本練習自己操law,但你硬要學校改變幫你操練，對唔住，你入之前已知學校情況係咁，你都要入?要知道唔係個個父母都想操練。而且，佢公開試成績睇唔到有咩問題。真係担心，我建議係買本練習自己操吧！

samsam123321

我想，大家真係不要對esf學校有太多期望，家長如果覺得考試成績係十分重要，應該自己對子女加強訓練。因為小學無考試，對於放任子女學習係非常危險，要多加注意，不要只靠學校

oooray

回覆 nintendo 的帖子

非常有深度的評論。
ESF中學現行直升；照單全收的制度；有唔讀書的學生是必然；(local school都會分下Band 123)。作為一個小學家長；不難想像上到中學後；學生質素會有天堂地獄之分。

Jane1983

真係，local school都有band123生，國際學校學生又點會個個都係天之驕子！？

學生吾會因為入咗一間學校，就自自然成才，變得好叻，尤其Esf係有教無類，英文過關就收的non selective school。

samsam123321

英基既問題係大班，但其實又係錢的問題，其實想下都估到，起碼要30個學生先養得起兩個老師再加行政，要小班，係要加學費，家長又願不願意。仲要每位家長都認同多功課，多reinforcement 先可以實行其他精英學校的模式。依個模式同傳統英基模式係唔同，我睇都好難改變。
所以，如喜歡英基所提供的好處（可能係較低學費，多活動，英語教育），又不滿部分學業成績不達本地水準，請家長跟緊些，如果放任不理，在中文，數學上，在小學畢業前極有可能低過本地生水準。

Radiomama

贊同你的看法。
作為英基PIS的家長，兒子在Y6, 見到他將要面對中學挑戰，的確步步為營。
我也曾做parent helper, 入課室幫忙小組進行；我的意見是英基跟普遍學校一樣，最叻與最沉底的學生都需要分開照顧。

bebemuimui

去麥記要食油炸鬼,唔該返去粥店.
客觀睇,全球IB平均2X分,英基3X分,起碼佢冇輸給全球.
我細個讀1級2百多人每班42人,只有30人入到Band1,你想唔想英基變成咁？
30人已經算小班，我自己滿意。
英基一早係web列左教學方法,硬要入去啱嗎？
冇一間學校係完美,自己個仔得就讃自己，衰就賴人。我係英基老師會覺得好灰。

happyfleet

原帖由 Radiomama 於 14-11-10 發表
贊同你的看法。
作為英基PIS的家長，兒子在Y6, 見到他將要面對中學挑戰，的確步步為營。
我也曾做parent he ...

請問英基PIS比英基小班嗎？學生學術跟進方面你滿意嗎？

macdullbaby

講得好啱！

macdullbaby

原帖由 bebemuimui 於 14-11-10 發表
去麥記要食油炸鬼,唔該返去粥店.
客觀睇,全球IB平均2X分,英基3X分,起碼佢冇輸給全球.
我細個讀1級2百多人每 ...

講得好啱

Radiomama

回覆 happyfleet 的帖子

PIS 跟英基小學基本上差不多，一班28人，一級有六班。Y1時每班一位Class Teacher+一位EA, Y2-6就每級有3位EA; 另外學校有聘請SEN teacher, 亦有gifted coordinator, 行IBPYP課程，中文按程度劃分，較好的pathway 3也分了兩班，每班約20人。
硬件不差，但一所學校最重要是要有有heart的老師和有vision的管理層，有時真的可遇不可求。

thomastaxi

我覺得d人美化左LS,細個班老師有幾多識教人?

gatochat

For me, I just would like my children to enjoy learning.  As long as he enjoys learning and have the right attitude, eventually he will get to where he wants.  That's all I want.  

I went to a famous local school myself and I started to struggle at upper primary and by the time I was at junior high, I basically gave up on catching up.  It was lucky that my parents could afford to send me overseas and I was allowed to catch up on my school work and ended studying Engineering at Uni.

All I wanted to say is that even top schools have the same problem. If I stayed in HK longer, the school would probably get rid of me eventually to make their results look better.

Yes, ESF is an non-selective school, and their results are really quite good considering they have no control on the children's ability at entry level.  and I once heard from a friend of mine, ESF really is like state comprehensive schools in the UK.

jolalee

保充一句：物離鄉貴。唔好問點解俾唔少錢，ESF只得 UK state schools 的質素。

nintendo

elmostoney 發表於 14-11-10 13:46
入左都可以批評掛? esf教數最大问题唔係操練咁簡單，係老師兼顧唔到咁大班，而程度的variance咁大。esf吸 ...

It is really funny, isn't it?
Those that blindly defend the school, and repeatedly stress how good the IB or IGCSE results are, are usually those that have much younger kids.  Most parents that think there are "problems" with ESF are usually those that have been with ESF for longer time, and have kids that are much older.

"係老師兼顧唔到咁大班，而程度的variance咁大。"

I totally accept the fact that the variance is huge. Everyone has different abilities. Other schools also have students with relatively poor grades. Even with local elites like DGS or SPCC, they have students that do not perform well. I think I am ok with that. The biggest issue with ESF is however that teachers do not put their hearts in their job. They teach in class and that is about it. Most teachers do not teach with heart.
And I do not agree with what someone said. I do not agree that since we do not pay as high a fee (compared to other schools), we should expect to get less. And, the most frustrating thing is that, there are so many ESF parents that think it is ok to expect less. And they keep asking other parents that have expectations to shut up.

Choisumwong

英基是有資源把敎學做得便好，只是管理層太多人，不想改變，便不讓家長知道真相。十年前參加旅行團，有個團友（在英基總部做行政）說英基花了很多錢在總部，所以他的子女只會選讀直資學校，因為比較經濟及合理。我當時也不明白，直到子女在英基讀了多年才明白！
現在英基的學費不算貴，但老師要應付三十，不同能力，不同集中力的學生，實在很難敎得好！
我想英基總部的支出可以減少，學校的敎學管理是有空間改善。

nintendo

Choisumwong 發表於 14-11-11 10:16
英基是有資源把敎學做得便好，只是管理層太多人，不想改變，便不讓家長知道真相。十年前參加旅行團，有個團 ...

Most money goes to management at headquarter. Frontline teachers are paid poorly, compared to other international schools. Heard that even the package at the PIS is a lot better than ESF. This may explain why ESF teachers have low spirit.

elmostoney

nintendo & choisumwong, 同意之極. 我交application form時, 剛好差少少 miss deadline, 所以親自去左佢地個office headquarter交, 唔郵寄.  上到去真係嚇左我一跳, 智能全新office building, 高層全海景, 兩個非常得閒嘅外籍人士receptionists, 無敵大嘅reception區 , 有埋open area 係旁邊開會 (兩個加起來, 比我地外人睇到, 唔係坐office人嘅地區, 我估過千呎), 但地方主要都係空空如也.  當時印象好差, 因為我個女係另一間IS讀, 佢地係upstart, 可以見到學校係staffing同office都好慳, 資源都留返比學生, 成一個強烈對比.  感覺就係esf花好多時間美化headquarter, 又唔係物野投資銀行或係誇國公司, 洗唔洗?  佢地要見物野客?  要咁大排場?  點解d $唔係留比學校用?  未上過佢地headquarter嘅家長, 又defend esf嘅教育質素的, 唔該你地自己上去睇睇.

我個仔好幸運, 今年遇上個好有heart嘅老師 (我個女舊年老師), 但佢承認30人, 真係冇法manage到.  我好記得, 舊年我去做parent helper 時, 有個小朋友math分組時唔做野, 我教佢, 佢都唔肯. 後來我問老師, 睇下洗唔洗同佢照肺. 老師話佢係外國來的, 剛係個年開學轉來, 程度追唔上, 但係老師自己表示無能為力, 因為一班人太多, 好難手把手去帶某幾個人.  

其實esf學費唔算平, 係家長比得比其他學校少, 但當你加返政府subsidy, 又計返30人一班, 其實比我個女而家讀緊間都係差唔多, 但我個女個間係平均一班20~22人 (雖然話可收到25, 但我所知冇), 所以佢地一班收的總學費, 其實比esf一班收入少.  印像中聽講政府冇subsidy計, 過幾年入學的學生學費約一萬, 我個女而家學費就係一萬.  即係話esf 一班可收三十萬學費.

至於我之前所講操練, 唔係講帶物野功課返屋企狂做, 我個女都冇.  我覺得返全日學的小學, 最好大部份都係學校做. 我知我個女學校有工作紙, 數量比我個仔係esf多, 而esf老師不一定會check, 即係你有你做, 對錯就未必次次知, 最重要都係assessment.  但我個女個間學校就一定會 check.  老師對學生progress相對esf, 我覺得跟得緊好多, 但我個女返學都一樣冇壓力.

當然有人會問, 點解我唔轉埋阿仔去阿女學校, 既然我講呢間比esf好, 因為佢地係新校, 冇中學, 呢個係 唯一原因.  早兩日我先同我先生傾, 如果唔係中學原因, 唔需要揀, 我地第一時間會轉返細仔去大女間學校.