Do children with "perfect pitch" consider as Gifted?

Rachethew

Please comment.

小孩子的天空

我個人理解音樂資優在社會的定義是已有特殊的成就的人或在很短時間逹到某程度的人,而不是有某種能力. 我想"perfect pitch"對學string instrument 的小朋友有很大的幫助.但有不少擁有'絕對音凖'的孩子沒有用功,結果也是徙然.

但不可否認擁有'絕對音凖'的孩子比一般孩子學得快,而且音樂感,節奏感比較優越,若果你們有這樣的孩子要多加努力!

SLI

Dear all,

According to Dr. Glenn Doman and Dr. Shichida, perfect pitch can be trained during childhood, esp. between 0 - 6.  It's a right brain function.

Depend on how you defined as 'gifted' , if it comes naturally, then it's a inborn gift. But if one is trained to acquire such skill , then I won't call it as a 'gift'.

SLI

  

DBBoy

I totally agree with SLI.

I would stress again that "giftedenss" in a child is in most cases a gift from the parents through:

1.  exposing your child to an environment that nuture certain talents;

2.  by believing in them;

3.  early stimulation from birth;

4.  controlling the messages that you send to your child and always maintain a positive attitude.

Giftedeness is not something that falls from the sky or something that happens by chance  

I have seen many many examples that confirm the views of SLI and I.

DBB

faith

DBBOY:
       不知是否我的英文有問題，但我覺得sli的說法好似和你的有點出入...????????

前一陣子也看到有關討論類似的topic，指perfect pitch這東西是可以訓練的，但也真的有些是天生的。
所以也認同sli所說的。
個人認為 gifted 即禮物，天賜的意思。成就和gifted是兩回事，成就、成果 不等於 資優；資優不等於 成績、成果、成功﹗  有成就可以是悉心訓練、或經努力勤奮，特殊守培而來。但我想所謂的gifted資優(天資優秀)，不一定有好成就呢

牙尖咀利的faith

Rachethew

Actually we found that our son could distinguish every note of the piano with the corrected pitch when he was 4 years old, and now he can recognize a chord correctly (up to 3 notes). What else can we do to further develope/maximize his potential other than intrusmental training?

DBBoy

You can take him to a choir

You can get a teacher and teach him music earlier than others.  There is not many other variations.  However, mathematics is very much linked to music and maybe he could have a talent in this field as well.

DBB

Rachethew

Hi, DBBoy,

Thanks a lot for your information. He is now joining the HK Children Choir. I hope that he can also have talent in Maths.

juke5301

hey this is a good question.

to me, no.
because everyone is born with perfect pitch, but it is the environment that finally alters it.
However, it could be reattained with training.
secondly, children without perfect pitch can also learn  music or play a musical instrument at the same level as the ones with perfect pitch. For me, perfect pitch only comes into use in ABRSM exams.
talent had to be nurtured, maybe parents can focus more on getting the right type of training for the children

Elizabethsmom

As I've studied more in Music, I have recognized that Perfect pitch is a gift.  Not everyone has it.  Most people can be trained and have "Relative Pitch".  Like my roommate is a pianist.  She has perfect pitch.  I asked her to give me an "a" or "c" etc, she can just sing the pitch right away.  On the other hand, I only have Relative pitch.  If you asked me to give you a "c", I would have to think for a second to give you the pitch.  
Also, there are a lot of people singing out of tune, do you think they have perfect pitch, too? or tone deaf?
I do agree that perfect pitch means you have good ears.  String Instruments require good ears.  
Music does somehow related to Maths!!
so, what do you think?   

faith

Elizabethsmom,
       我很同意你的說法啊﹗
        我仔仔在數學上某程度好似有天份，在彈鋼琴方面也較一般同年的學得快，所以我想這兩者有點關聯吧？？
雖然他不是perfect pitch，但偶然發現他在聽音上也不錯，不過是和我比較，當時三歲大半的怹，你叫他走開，然後你按一個鋼琴key，再叫他回來，他都有五成至八成按對，包括黑白鍵，不對的大都是很低音和很高音的黑鍵。相對我....他也叫我走開，然後他去按叫我"猜"，竟然一個都不中，我摸個琴都摸多個佢四、五年呢？

訓練回來的叫relative pitch嗎？

hkgurl06

if you look at the frequency function of an adult, the audible range  is most senstivie at midrange.
at low frequency, the audible range is lesssensitive, but at high freqency, the range drops rapidly.
probably your child failed to recognize veyr high or low notes are due to  a physiological phenonmenon

faith 寫道:
Elizabethsmom,
       我很同意你的說法啊﹗
        我仔仔在數學上某程度好似有天份，在彈鋼琴方面也較一般同年的學得快，所以我想這兩者有點關聯吧？？
雖然他不是perfect pitch，但偶然發現他在聽音上也不錯，不過是和我比較，當時三歲大半的怹，你叫他走開，然後你按一個鋼琴key，再叫他回來，他都有五成至八成按對，包括黑白鍵，不對的大都是很低音和很高音的黑鍵。相對我....他也叫我走開，然後他去按叫我"猜"，竟然一個都不中，我摸個琴都摸多個佢四、五年呢？

訓練回來的叫relative pitch嗎？

faith

hkgurl06,
        想知道 physiological phenonmenon 的意思，是指那些問題呢？thanks  :wink:

JP

Elizabethsmom 寫道:
As I've studied more in Music, I have recognized that Perfect pitch is a gift.  Not everyone has it.  Most people can be trained and have "Relative Pitch".  Like my roommate is a pianist.  She has perfect pitch.  I asked her to give me an "a" or "c" etc, she can just sing the pitch right away.  On the other hand, I only have Relative pitch.  If you asked me to give you a "c", I would have to think for a second to give you the pitch.  
Also, there are a lot of people singing out of tune, do you think they have perfect pitch, too? or tone deaf?
I do agree that perfect pitch means you have good ears.  String Instruments require good ears.  
Music does somehow related to Maths!!
so, what do you think?   

Hello,Elizabethsmom/Rachethew,
I just want to know how do we know whether someone has "perfect pitch"? Is there any test for that?

Rachethew,

A Canadian Chinese kid, Wesley Chu 朱天麟, has inborn perfect pitch as alleged by his father on RTHK program. He's really a gifted/talented kid in Music. According to his father, Wesley can master those piano pieces within 2 hours while other ordinary person may need 6 months to learn. That's why he can obtain grade 8 and diploma when he's 5 yr old.   

hkgurl06

perception in particular deals with our biological responses when a stimulus is presented to you.
of course, the way we perceive it can affect what we finallly feel/see about the stimulus.
Take the figure-ground illusion (face or vase) for example, we will see either a face or a vase when appropriate cues are given to the participant, these are top-down illusions, a result of the interference of subjective knowledge which finally led to the apparent perception we see

therefore physiological phenomenon just simply indicates our natural repsonse when a stimulus is presented, excluding the subjective interpretation of the stimulus.
in the case of auditory perception, even though we can percevie normally within the range of 30-20000Hz, adults perceive better when the frequency is in the mid-range of the above frequency stated, this is due to the biological strucutre of our ears, our pinna ( the outer visible part of our organ) has ridges that would maximize certain frequencies that reach our ears and reduce others, it might had been an evlutionary advantage, but for now, we will jsut focus it onto hearing music. Thus it is the biological mechanism of the person that affects his/her perception of the stimulus, but not her conscious thoughts altering his/her interpretation of the stimulus.
What i want to say here that it is probably normal for a 'perfect-pitch' child to have relatively more difficulty in recognizing pitches from extreme frequencies, simply because our biological mechanism wasn't accomodated to perceiving piches of that nature. Failure in correcting identifying pitches of extreme frequency does not mean that their abilities are weaker than other people.

all our children are lovely creatures

faith

hkgurl06
     thank you for your explanation.   

Rachethew

Hi, JP

Actually I don't have any special test for "perfect pitch". I could remember one day when I was playing piano with my son, I just wanted to play a game with him. I played different notes and asked him whether he could recognise the pitches or not. Surprisingly he was totally correct. And all the songs that he heard before(e.g. the ringtone of a mobile phone), He can play it out on the piano. Then I further confirmed this "talent" with his piano and violin teachers. Now he can recognise the pitches in chord. If you want to know whether your child is "perfect pitch" or not, maybe you an try this method. (Maybe someone have some other scientific/ well-organised methods but sorry I don't know)

Rachethew

Jackie

I myself have "perfect pitch".  But I did not realize this is a special talent until around 13 years old.  But I got grade 8 piano at around 14/15 years old.  I was the accompanist/pianist for school choir and teacher always asked me to give A or C when there is no piano.  Having perfect pitch is excellent when you need to hear the interval (of two notes) during aural piano exam.  But having perfect pitch is awful when you are given a musical score and have to sing it at a lower scale (e.g. 2 notes lower, 唱低兩個key).  For example, I see a "C" on the musical score, but as everyone is singing 2 notes lower (transpose), then I would be very busy, having to move all notes 2 notes lower in order to match every one's pitch!