Sharing of IB vs NSS

ANChan59

Are the best and worst aspects of being an IB student?

Best

International perspective
Wide range of subjects
Independence
Responsibility
International reputation
Creativity
Great teachers
Like-minded peers
CAS
Critical thinking
Language, opportunities

Worst


Heavy workload
Too many assessments
Subjects you don't like
Fewer subject options
Setting targets too often
Not many schools offer IB
Too much reflection
TOK
Impacts on social life
Highly pressured

From IB World, Feb 2012

What's your comments?

ANChan59

ANChan59,

可唔可以講吓你覺得邊類性格小朋友唔太適合IB的呢? (except 時間管理差,語文能力差,欠閱讀興趣,被動等等) 因為我都諗緊呢個問題.

Thanks !

Christi

*************************************************

Your question is difficult to answer when related to character(s), I did some researches in internet and can't find many info related to your question. More related pros and cons of IB.

I talked to my son and he provided some observations:

1. All students can survive in IB to score a pass, get 24, may be easier than HKDSE. So they can relax to learn or hea.... (Ha, that's why HKUST only accept students got 30+ in actual score. His comments more on IB in general, not his school specific.). Score high in IB is the real challenge, just think about the core modules, TOK, EE & CAS...

2. language proficiency, good computer skills, even weak in maths still can doing well in IB. But you are weak in language particular in English, poor computer skills, even your Maths and science are good, your can pass and survive in IB, but can't be flying colors.

3. Extensive reading and writing skills are fundamental study skills; presentation skills, critical thinking and analysis can be acquired through learning and practice.

4. Efficiency in learning and multitasking can be critical to do more with less.

5. Open-mind and receptive to take constructive feedback and critique from teachers and peers.

6. Motivation and willing to learn, lack of this, you can't do well in whatever curriculum.

7. Curiosity -> culture, innovation, attitude, environment, relationship .......

*************************************************************

His observations and comments may not the answers we think, but from another angle of a critical stakeholder - student himself......

Any comments?

Christi

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ANChan59,

謝謝你告訴我這帖放在高中教育這裡.我都不知道呢!

我是很喜歡看學生看法的人.學生在前線衝鋒陷陣,最了解戰場上什麼有用什麼會致命,所以請你的兒子有空便分享多一點他的心得吧...或者請你的兒子的爸爸繼續分享他的兒子的看法呀.

well...考IB取個pass 是沒有意思的(或者說,是很弊傢伙的).記得去年在一個講座上,一位IB校的副校長展示過香港學生vs全球學生的IB成績比較.連續好幾年香港學生都是above average的.當然,這不能太代表了什麼.只記得,副校說過,IB要pass,不難(一般而言,不是說TOK).要攞高分(40+),很難.(於我看來,這正如到外國留學,要隨隨便便入一間大學,不難,要入一間好的大學,難,情況大致是一樣的.事實上,如果只考到2X分,算是低分的了,還未說有一些著名大學,根本不接受retake IB的學生來面試.)

然後,是接觸了另一間有很多外國學生,但一直走GCE A level的學校的副校.副校說得很白,他們不走IB的原因,是他們是主力保送學生入一些似樣的大學,而IB不是人人合適,如果為追潮流走IB但訓練出的學生如果只是so so,那只是害了他們.

我理解後者那位副校解釋捨難取易的原因,除了是為學生考慮外,學校的定位及生存的理由也是重要考慮因素.不過,我心想,撇除課程及教師質素及資源等等問題,有學校由day 1開始便拒絕IB訓練, 莫非有學生本質上(用本質是有點誇張,但暫想不到另一字眼,姑且用住先)沒有辦法考好IB(是考好,不是考合格)? 於我看來,最大的阻礙,是自我管理差及思想不夠活躍. 有一些阻礙,應該是可以經過訓練而改好的,但有一些,應該是死症來的.

這亦導致一些擔憂,就是現在香港也有好一部份的學校走IB(甚至不是走IB,而是走所謂IB模式)線,但最終表現如何,我覺得要很審慎來看待.

路人甲
Christi

kym

想請教路人甲前輩, 點解GCE A level 就可以入一些好的大學, 讀IB課程就反宜就不能呢?

bobbycheung

".....有一些阻礙,應該是可以經過訓練而改好的,但有一些,應該是死症來的.........這亦導致一些擔憂,就是現在香港也有好一部份的學校走IB(甚至不是走IB,而是走所謂IB模式)線,但最終表現如何,我覺得要很審慎來看待"

To do well in IB, excellent English is a must.  Rather than anything else, this is exactly what is lacking in HK students in general.  In A-levels, we could always focus on science subjects and maths instead if one's English is not quite up to par.  But in IB, students have to do 2 languages (which for most HK students mean English and Chinese).  In addition, one has to do one humanity at least as well as EE and TOK.  Without excellent command of English, it becomes an impossible task.  WYmom pointed out in another thread that "IB's essence is "Critical Thinking" across all subjects."  But the sad truth is that excellent critical thinking won't do much help if one has difficulties in comprehending the questions and in expressing one's thoughts clearly and well, all in English.  I always thought if you ask any professor in HK to tackle and answer a primary school question in say Finnish, he will probably fare a lot worse than an average primary school kid in Finland.  Not that he is stupid or anything, it's just that he wouldn't understand the question and put the answer in Finnish.  That's all.  Another problem with poor English is that you can't really "cure" it by giving the students condensed exam tips as you could with science subjects.  To most students in HK, this is probably the insurmountable challenge of IB.

Christi

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前乜野輩,晚輩至真~~

那只是那位副校長咁講.佢解釋因為GCE是相對淺的考試. 佢咁講,可能只係講咗其中一個point比我聽.亦有可能仲因為佢地收的學生並不是最突出的一群/校方未能滿足IBO要求/找不到或資源上請不到所需老師...之類.呢啲,我諗佢都唔會同我講.   所以,佢咁講,我姑且當係聽咗一個策略返嚟(當然,佢講呢個策略,未必係對班學生係唔好的),無再去研究佢講既原因係咪有普遍性(好的GCE成績考的大學或學系好啲/抑或中庸的IB成績考的大學或學系好啲). .而佢咁講令我想知多少少的,反而是[IB不是人人適合]這一點,就是如果撇除客觀因素,係咪真係有些學生很難訓練去考好IB的.

就住你的問題,可能其他網友仲有更多input呢...

ultramanmama

Hi ANChan59

Could you please advise details of English tutorial classes? Thanks

火柴

我今年簡dse/ib, 我諗我同你個仔一樣同一間學校. hang hau某中學.
我而家都唔知點簡好, 因為我都係aim for 3大, poly and cityu. dse我冇乜信心, 但校長叫我讀dse如果想讀香港d大學. 如果唔係冇左ce, al我一定簡舊制. 簡ib既學生多數都去外國讀. 但我都有諗過ib, 但ib我見我fd係island school讀ib dp佢d work多數痴哂線. (佢以前讀dbs)
聽講過ib 冇返36分以上香港都唔會有大學簡. 24分既話係咪多數都係去外國d冇咁出名既大學. 咁計既話姐係每樣要有6－5分先得 （7分滿分)我見我d同學有時都唔係成日做野又唔係成日合格走去讀ib, 唔知佢地係咪玩自己. 其實ib我都有諗過去美國讀, 見美國好多ib學校都考到好勁既大學. 但我相信d work會比香港更多更瘋狂. 而家我仲煩緊dse好定ib好呀唔係淨係我, 屋企人都為我煩緊 其實我都係驚我頂唔順咁多野做....呀....好難簡呀 :((((岩岩睇返上面乜30分以上就入得ust!?!?!?!?

ANChan59

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火柴
It's great to have a student join in the discussion and share your first hand info with us.

First, my son not study in your school, but I know some friends's kids study in your school. But they don't take IB and only take DSE and plan to study overseas, which is quite contradict your vice-principal's comment on IB vs DSE. They didnt take your school's IB due to the following reasons:

1. Their kids' English standard not so good to take IB;
2. The work load is too demanding; and
3. They pick the school because of the special curriculum and IB approach. It takes too long to run IB finally, they are not comfortable about the IB. They cross checked with other IB schools and discovered the info from ex-principal and vice principal may not the true picture of IB, like their students go for DSE and IB simultaneously.....


HKDSE and IB students can apply local universities, not necessary go for overseas. You need to have critical thinking  mindset to evaluate different sources of info. I can assure you, you are practicing critical thinking right now. If the school follow DBS and SPCC, you can apply both curriculum first and wait for the final results in July, then make the final decision. 用時間換取空間。Most of your questions are discussed in this thread, you can share with your parents and seek for their views and support.


When we discussed IB PG, 24 is the passing mark to grant the diploma only. In HKUST, they prefer students score 30+. 36+ aim for popular program like BBA QFin.... If you take HKDSE, you also need to good grades. For low grades in IB, you can get in not so popular programs easily, but not Big 3. Apply local university, you can only
pick either JUPAS or non-JUPAS, so why you listen to your vice-principal to take both HKDSE & IBDP together. Pick one, focus and work hard, "One bird in nand...."

More personal question, can you learn some skills, mindset, exposure for life in IB and or DSE? If yes, do you mind to work extremely hard at this stage and enjoy more in college?

I guess other parents will provide better advices for you......

ANChan59

riccichu

Mr Chan

Do you think this offers are good. I couldn't see those offers are conditional or unconditional.  My son also the year 1 IB student and ready for Us by the end of this year. Your post is very useful and eager to have more info and share with all parents.

Mr. CHU

riccichu

I forgot the line

http://www.dbs.edu.hk/datafiles/ ... February%202012.pdf

ANChan59

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All HK offers are conditional offers, but some said conditional offers just equivalent to unconditional offers, very reasonable. Offers from UK are conditional, North American universities offers are unconditional.
You can make an appointment with your son's IB adviser, and or university counselor (Leo Zen), they can share  more details with you.

riccichu

ANChan59,

thanks for your info. I will make an appointment later. Somtimes I worry that I don't know how to ask because i don't have much info about this issue. I have to update my knowledge thor' this forum. Very useful, thanks a lot!

火柴

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哈哈, 我都可以好開心可以同你地分享拎多d意見.唔怪得之校長同我講岩岩入到hku個d全部本身都係天才. 佢話就算比我爆哂都好佢估我最多得30分左右. 36都好難. 雖然local u 好多都looking for international students. 但係如果考唔掂dse外國又點會有大學收呢, 最多會放去foundation. 如果考美國d大學好多都要sat score. 反而我呢一級d同學10個有9個都簡ib, 簡dse個d都係冇乜打算個d/fail左myp/少數好似我咁簡local u. 最得人驚係成個house得我一個係dse.....雖然我唔會拎到myp certificate因為插班, 同埋聽人話我成績表最多得幾分因為插班. 岩岩過去個星期5老師叫我唔洗prepare就咁試下做oral, 睇下我程度係邊. 係十五分鐘比我諗下有咩講之下, 我只拎到5-4/8, 當堂灰哂. 佢話如果我本身有跟開佢地又做返d research會去到7-8.
如果take dse我只怕收生唔嚴既local u 都冇得比我入. 其實我都有d驚dse, 因為我中二開始讀國際學校, 讀左兩年半到而家岩岩先轉左入去, 所以簡既科目最多可以簡science, 其他business 個d我都唔可以簡. 咁多科我最怕中文, 因為我冇讀中文兩年半好多字/詞語都唔記得哂點寫. 校考長睇過我d英文, 佢話我都係似返香港d水平. 所以叫我簡返dse. 我轉到入去呢間中學因為我最近個張成績表係一路自修dse, 顧學校d野拎到1a, 3b+, 2c, 1d, gpa 2.7(得2.7都收我真係好彩). 其實我都明, 因為我之前讀國際學校個陣時冇乜努力去搞好英文, 背完d生字做完test都唔會再記住, 小說一年睇得一兩本, 有唔明既字唔去查. 而家大個左都覺得學英文冇shortcut, 我而家開始係咁讀係咁查英文, sat書都買埋(係唔係都要考, 唔想浪費之前讀國際學校既時間), 可惜而家我覺得太遲, 唯有盡量. 我估我英文最多得4, dse加上要同d名校band 1爭, 香港都唔少band 1學校. 其實如果讀ib我會簡esf個d, 因為佢地起碼有經驗. 但係我慘到考唔入. 之前屋企人叫我去外國讀書但我唔去, 因為我認我無知, 好多人想去都冇得去,因為我唔知有咩得著 :S  屋企人話大個出黎做野多數會請外國讀既返黎, 3大個d出到黎都未必搵到野做bor. 可能一舊舊請見諒><
anyway thanks ANChan59 :)

ANChan59

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It's my pleasure to read your sharing, you know what you are doing and your weakness, it's a good start.
Can you list out your action plan and goals for coming term for yourself? I guess you can improve a lot academically in both Chinese and English, then make your final decision in July.

ANChan59

回復 riccichu 的帖子

Work out the questions you want to ask with your boy, get him heavily involve before meeting with the adviser.
Encourage him to chat with seniors, he can get views from students angle, which also very useful and reviewing.

riccichu

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thanks for your suggeestion.

My son seems to be very passive. He seldoms look for more information that he needs. Seldom share his future with others. I don't know if he would talk to the senior boys in the school. I think it's totally different from your son. I get only a little from him about his school life. However, he recently told me that he aims for LAW Faculty of HKU but nothing to do with that.Ha Ha..... As a father, from now, I have to work with him and encourage him what he should perpare now. His score is above the average but i am not sure his ability in the interview "LAW" is the same. I've watched the  admission talk of last year "HKU Law Faculty" which was post by you. It's very useful and of course I will share the info with my son. I would like to share more with you and I will keep updating my info. And how's your son's progress?

ANChan59

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Riccichu
Our sons may not want us to talk about their details here, I will reply to you in PM.

ANChan59

kym

Read the DBS University offers. Not bad for the first batch of the IB student, I would be very happy if my son can get in anyone of the two LSE econ, NYU business.

ANChan59

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He also considers local universities as well???