Why can't ESF Primary take all ESF Kindy kids???

PoohsBaby

It is difficult to understand why ESF Primary schools can't accept all (or most) kids from ESF Kindy.   Why are they called ESF kindy if they are not given a place in ESF Primary.
What's this bullshxt about ESF Kindy have priority for interview but no gaurantee they get a place???   If these ESF Primary don't believe the Kindergartens under their own system they might as well use OPEN recruitment policy and terminate this messy CAT 1 - CAT 2 business.   
Their admission policy is extremely outdated and needs a major revamp.
I feel sorry for the poor mum who jumped off the building at Shamshuipo ... What can these ESF K2 kids go if the ESF primary schools don't offer them a place??? Their standard of Chinese will not allow them to go back to the traditional Chinese schools!
Why are these ESF Primary schools going to other Kindergartens for recruitment.   If they consider the quality of ESF Kindy as poor then do something about it ...

highfive

First off, a little disclaimer, I'm not an ESF parent. We did submit applications to ESF primary schools as Cat-2 applicant but my child now studies in a non-ESF international school.

I don't think it's fair to blame ESF for their admission policy. The whole ESF system was set up to accommodate non-Chinese speaking children who otherwise have no access to our education system. They only started opening their door to local families because of the demand. Local families that choose to send their children to ESF kindergartens should be well aware of this fact and the risks involved.

Responsible parents should always have a backup plan for their children in case they do not get an ESF primary place. Such backup plans could be applications to the many other international schools in Hong Kong, or additional Chinese tuition to prepare for going back to the local system. And as another parent has pointed out in another discussion thread, it might not actually be that difficult for an ESF student to go back to the local system at such young age.

Leanna

I don't think the fail ratio is as high as outside said.  

Just share my  experience: my son studied in TY ESF 2 years ago, and really, some of the schoolmates did failed in the P1 interview but finally taken in the 2nd round, or stayed in K3 and applied for the next year.  Those who stayed in K3 are relatively young, like 細仔, seems not yet ready for primary school life.  All the parents I know would think that arrangement is reasonable and acceptable.  

Actually, as I know most of the parents in ESF are quite low profile, and may not like to make clarification in local forums.  All of us know what game are we taking and so far, I'm really satisfy with it.:loveliness: :loveliness:

Leanna

原帖由 highfive 於 10-2-12 01:08 發表
First off, a little disclaimer, I'm not an ESF parent. We did submit applications to ESF primary schools as Cat-2 applicant but my child now studies in a non-ESF international school.

I don't think i ...

You're right.  For the local family in ESF like us, we had keep up to teach my son's Chinese.  We did ready to go back to the local stream in case he is not suitable to IS, not only beacuse of ESF.

[ 本帖最後由 Leanna 於 10-2-12 02:00 編輯 ]

Mighty

Totally disagree with Poohsbaby.  While Cat 1 students are becoming less than 10 years ago, they do still exist as a minority.  I think it is very good that ESF sticks to their Cat 1 / Cat 2 policy otherwise where can Cat 1 students go when they really cannot, unlike those so called English speaking local kids, fit in local schools.  

Are there enough universities here in Hong Kong to cater all high school kids?  According to your theory, lots of secondary schools need to be closed then?

The case in Shamsuipo is really an individual case and should not be taken to blame ESF admission  policy.

oooray

As a ESF kinda parent, I don't think ESF primary should take all kinder students even if they have not yet been ready.
If my children cannot pass the interview, that means he/she is not qualified at that moment. That's all.

The "menu" of the game has been there for a long time.
If you have decided to play the game, don't blame "it was not fair" after you lose the game;
If you think "the game is not fair", don't play the game.
If you don't read the "Menu" before playing the game, who should we blame?

jjd

Alliance Primary School in Kowloon Tong only accepts 30% of its kindergarten students every year for primary one.  The rest is forced to go to other local schools.  The school also accepts students from other kindergartens on a selective basis.  Nobody complains about that.  Alliance Primary School has never been blamed.  Why?  The only reason being ESF schools are international schools and international schools are more proned to being attacked.

bakusensei

原帖由 jjd 於 10-2-12 11:36 發表
Alliance Primary School in Kowloon Tong only accepts 30% of its kindergarten students every year for primary one.  The rest is forced to go to other local schools.  The school also accepts students fr ...

Even for other int'l schools, like ICS, they won't accept all kids from the kinder even they have 75 seats for pre-Grade 1 which should be able to accept all the 60 kinder kids.

ICS kinder kids also need to go through the same assessment test like other outside applicants.

inho

The selection criteria to be admitted to primary 1? If English ability the major criterion, parents should pay attention to it at the very beginning.

CSJ安樂窩

Yes, be able to study in an English environment is what they are looking for.  Sadly speaking, a lot of parents still think that once they entered the ESF community, their kids had entered a 'through train' system.  This is WRONG.

ESF kinder pointed out in the contract that they do not garantee a place for primary but a lot of parents still think that, 'of course ESF say so, only because they don't want to commit themselves.'  Well, Yes, maybe thats true but in reality, this is the FACT.  So far, I have only seen kids failing to get a place because they FAIL the interview but if you have passed the interview, a school will be allocated later on, say by May or June.

原帖由 inho 於 10-2-12 12:48 發表
The selection criteria to be admitted to primary 1? If English ability the major criterion, parents should pay attention to it at the very beginning.

strayteddy

Just another one to seize on the tragedy to attack ESF with weird logic.

If you really feel sorry for the family, why don't you let the incident fade from the spotlight and let the father and the daughter heal their wounds.

原帖由 PoohsBaby 於 10-2-12 00:34 發表
It is difficult to understand why ESF Primary schools can't accept all (or most) kids from ESF Kindy.   Why are they called ESF kindy if they are not given a place in ESF Primary.
What's this bullshxt ...

[ 本帖最後由 strayteddy 於 10-2-12 18:09 編輯 ]

PoohsBaby

What do you mean by 'weird' logic?? Kids going to ESF Kindy are poor in Chinese ... so if they don't get into an ESF Primary school where can they go.   Not everyone can afford other IS and if they do go to local kindy they may have to repeat K2.   

原帖由 strayteddy 於 10-2-12 14:47 發表
Just another one to seize on the tragedy to attack ESF with weird logic.

If you really feel sorry for the family, why don't you let the incident fade from the spotlight and let the father and the dau ...

PoohsBaby

You don't get the point, kids going to ESF Kindy will have a very difficult time catching up with their Chinese as compared to Alliance Pri School, how can you compare ????

原帖由 jjd 於 10-2-12 11:36 發表
Alliance Primary School in Kowloon Tong only accepts 30% of its kindergarten students every year for primary one.  The rest is forced to go to other local schools.  The school also accepts students fr ...

PoohsBaby

The problem is many many parents try the menu i.e. claim their kids speak English only or their mother tongue is English, and ESF don't do a good job in catching these people.   These liars/cheats are causing the increase in Cat 1 applications and taking the places of genuine Cat 1 kids .... Yes, we all have a choice, but ESF have to do a better job in their selection criteria.

原帖由 oooray 於 10-2-12 09:45 發表
As a ESF kinda parent, I don't think ESF primary should take all kinder students even if they have not yet been ready.
If my children cannot pass the interview, that means he/she is not qualified at t ...

PoohsBaby

You got me wrong, I am saying it's an excellent system if everyone is playing fair and ESF can do more to ensure it is fair.   
There was actually more Cat 1 applications than the total number of seats this year because many people realize they can claim they only speak English and they can be classified as Cat 1.

原帖由 Mighty 於 10-2-12 09:12 發表
Totally disagree with Poohsbaby.  While Cat 1 students are becoming less than 10 years ago, they do still exist as a minority.  I think it is very good that ESF sticks to their Cat 1 / Cat 2 policy ot ...

Mighty

reply repeated.

[ 本帖最後由 Mighty 於 10-2-12 18:33 編輯 ]

Mighty

Nothing is perfect in this world. If you think the rule is not fair, then dont play the game.  ESF is not a must in Hong Kong's schooling and you have got other choices.  What I dont fancy is people nowadays always get something to blame.  Everything is wrong except himself.  If the title has been "why cant Hong Kong universities take all secondary school students in Hong Kong", what would you hv been thinking then?

strayteddy

The weird logic is obvious.  Responsible parents must have considered thoroughly what you mentioned before they decide on their children's education path. ESF should not be held responsible for the parents' own choice.

原帖由 PoohsBaby 於 10-2-12 21:58 發表
What do you mean by 'weird' logic?? Kids going to ESF Kindy are poor in Chinese ... so if they don't get into an ESF Primary school where can they go.   Not everyone can afford other IS and if they do ...

[ 本帖最後由 strayteddy 於 10-2-13 00:07 編輯 ]

jjd

You also don't get my point.
Of course I know it's hard for a ESF kindy kid to catch with local K2 kid in Chinese if his/her parent did ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to help the kid in Chinese while the child is attending ESF kindy.  Parents who send their kids to ESF kindy should have only targeted for ESF/other international primary schools.  They should apply other IS or at least consider other IS in case they fail the ESF interview.  True, some parents may not be able to afford other IS and the only option left would be to switch to local but if that is the case, they should have equipped their kids with a Chinese level at least close to a K2 local kid.  I do personally know a girl from ESF Tsing Yi whose Chinese is as good as a K3 local kid.  She also passed the interview of SJS.  Being good at Chinese does not necessarily mean poor in English.  It's really a matter of how much effort the parent put in and how well a parent has planned for his child.   

原帖由 PoohsBaby 於 10-2-12 22:01 發表
You don't get the point, kids going to ESF Kindy will have a very difficult time catching up with their Chinese as compared to Alliance Pri School, how can you compare ????