好不好用全英语跟孩子说话? 南华早报引述专家学者的意见

iamfine

If a German can speak with German accent, a French with French accent and a Finn with Finn accent, what's wrong with Chinese speaking with Chinese accent? Me too can't understand the obsession on the part of some parents with "native speaker level" and "accent-free English". Self prescribed and administered zoloft thingy?

[ 本帖最後由 iamfine 於 10-8-26 15:40 編輯 ]

Sumyeema1

這也是我的疑問。  為何一定要強調 Native level 呢？

記得多年前，公司還依賴錄影帶來傳達信息，各國的 country manager 發言的時候， marketing 的同事會幫英文口音重的country manager 配上英文字幕， 連澳洲的 country manager 也不例外， 澳洲的同事很氣憤地說： 我們講的是正宗英文， 為何要配字幕呀？ 笑得我。

身為家長，能為下一代提供中/英的學習環境，等孩子大了，可以透過中/英的語言溝通，吸收知識，我覺得已經不錯了。

原帖由 peremum 於 10-8-26 15:14 發表
I don't understand why we have to linger on the point of "native speaker level".  Do we mean fluency, or without accent or use of words?
Share with you 2 cases.
1) A friend of mine is raised by parent ...

peremum

Hi 77777. Nice to see you here.

I agree with you.  Do not mind so much whether the kids' English is "native" or not.  Rather make sure they are learning correct/good English.  

Based on this reason, my husband always stresses to our children that they should not learnt English from our Filippino helper.  Don't misunderstand me.  He is very nice to the helper & we have excellent relationship with her.  He just want to make sure that they learn the language correctly.  He emphasises that one must learn proper (never mind about the accent/tone) before one can play with English.

peremum

Hi stccmc

Good day to you!
Of course it is not for me to benchmark the kids' English level.  However I believe there are at least 2 touchstones that we can consider.
1) Objective testing - There are several reputable ESOL tests in H.K. e.g. Cambridge ESOL, London Test of English or AQA ESOL.  They are comprehensive test of all the 4 aspects of English Language.  I would say if a youngster is enrolled in such tests & get good result for his/her age/grade level, than we can safely conclude that his English is reasonably good.  For example, PET merit for a S2 student.
2) Subjective parameter - If a kid can handle all her English study satisfactory, read a lot of English materials appropriate to her age/grade (YES, I am a great fan, like you, of reading), listen & communicate in reasonable/comprehensible English, then I don't think the parents should worry much.

以上愚見, 誠乞指正!

peremum

LOVE is beyond words.  I don't think the kids will mind any minor (or even major) linguistic mistake, as long as our message to them is care & love.  So, stick to the language that you are comfortable with.
Or maybe keep an open mind & learn the language together with the kids.
Since a long time ago, my husband & I have given up trying to CORRECT our girl's English.  We just sit down & learn side by side.

peremum

Please accept my apologies for being stupid, but I believe that a lot of parents have expressed their view that we are not pursuing "native speaker" level English for our kids.  We just want our loved ones to have reasonably good English, so that they can qualify as global citizens.

1) Why do you want to benchmark against first language kids?  Do you want your kid's English to be mother tongue level, or is he already there?  
2) I cannot restrain myself from wondering why you discriminate against the ESOL tests.  Are you trying to tell us that if one is not born into a 1st language English family, his/her English is always inferior to a native speaker?
3) Do you mean benchmarking against school children of UK?  However, a lot of them are not themselves mother tongue English speaker.
I can assure you that I know how good is the average English standard in Britain.
4) As I have mentioned more than once.  As long as my kids can handle their day-in-day-out English usage, I can sleep well at night.

By the way, my girl has also taken some benchmark tests which compare her to the English standard of schoolgoers in the USA. (Well, maybe you can say USA is a multi-ethnical & therefore not 1st language English nation, but then how about UK?)  She is rated as 93 percentile among  all US kids of her grade level.  As a matter of fact, I earnestly doubt whether she can score much better than 93 percentile among HK children.

[ 本帖最後由 peremum 於 10-8-27 17:46 編輯 ]

peremum

Well, I am not 激動
Actually you are one of the contributors to BK who I admire much.
Totally agree with you that "其實是沒有必要追求某種口音，除非是想得到某國國民之認同，否則只要能流利溝通便可。"

I must clarify one point.  I never intend to say "香港本地學校學童的英文平均水平會高過英國學童的英文平均水平".  I just say that the English level of HK is not much worse than USA (but on average, I still believe US is a bit, just a bit, better).  For the UK, well, I can only say they are not as good as before, and our best teenagers are comparable to their UK counterparts.
However, I have just come across several college students from UK this summer which are very nice, good manner & well-educated.  All in all, I seldom see such good kids among HK youngsters.  HK youth tends to be good in study but not as good as a person.

Anyway, please accept my apologies if I have caused you misunderstanding about my intention.  Still friends?

peremum

Thanks for your kind reply.  There are always good (or even very good) & sub-par students in every nation.

也是題外話:
It is perfectly o.k. for parents to have hope that their children can speak in perfect English (for that matter, French, German, PTH, whatever).  My point is just that don't put too much stress & pressure on this.  The most important is don't "scare" the kids away from English.

By the way, I have been reading a lot about stccmc's girl in various forums. Maybe I am a newcomer & do not know much, but she is really my "idol".

peremum

For the accent issue, pls. refer my reply to Y2KChild.  

For the Singaporean, I always consider their education is very good & very suitable for a elitist society.

Frankly speaking, I also consider the ESOL system of Cambridge YLE system quite "conservative", while their exam for teens quite o.k.  Actually, I would say the following cross-reference is more appropriate.
Starter - K3 to P1
Mover - P2 to P3
Flyer - P4, max P5
KET - P5 to P6
PET - S1 to S2
FCE - S3 to S4
CAE - S5, max S6
CPE - hard to say for this one

As mentioned in my reply to Y2KChild, I am very interested in your girl.  If you deem it appropriate, pls. PM me & we can share our sweet/bitter experiences in raising a daughter.

peremum

Of course for average.  If for a talented or even gifted child, I would say the scale has to be shifted at least one level.

Whitepine

peremum,


" HK youth tends to be good in study but not as good as a person."

Yes, I also have the same feeling!!!

原帖由 peremum 於 10-8-27 18:18 發表
Well, I am not 激動
Actually you are one of the contributors to BK who I admire much.
Totally agree with you that "其實是沒有必要追求某種口音，除非是想得到某國國民之認同，否則只要能流利溝通便可。" ...

judy

We share the same view..You know what I'm thinking? It's that American got American accent, British got British accent , Australian got Australian accent, and they all think that their accent is the best, so what's wrong with Chinese accent anyway? Do we expect an European to speak Putonghua with perfect Putonghua accent? It's perfectly fine to me as long as the spoken English is not choppish. May be people just like picking bones from an egg. There is only one way to speak accent-free English, that is - don’t speak English at all.
It seems to me that some people don’t like being a Chinese, poor guy.

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