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请教數學題 [複製鏈接]


347
41#
發表於 15-2-23 16:19 |只看該作者
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1524
42#
發表於 15-2-23 21:54 |只看該作者
本帖最後由 laorenjia 於 15-2-24 01:46 編輯
lamyeelok 發表於 15-2-23 16:19
以我的學識及見識根本無需如你般吓吓要靠google揾料支持論點,網上的確很多資訊,但最重要是要明白、理解、 ...

My dear learned friend lamyeekok

You seem to have the habit of assuming a lot of things.

First you assumed I had mixed up real numbers and counting numbers and now you assume I have no idea what "used" means. I know for sure your assumptions were both wrong. The only assumption that could well be true is that you're a more learned man than me, a laorenjia who often has troubles in understanding what learned people say. I really do not understand what you mean by "直至mankind有智慧地懂得real numbers之概念,那才是有意義。你估人類懂得natural number之概念先還是real number先呢?" I thought I made it quite clear humans mastered the concept of real numbers very late but we had been happily using our knowledge on integers,  rational numbers and irrational numbers (all the components of a real number) all the time before Newton defined it for us. And you're saying this is meaningless? Why? I beg you to suppress your intuition and read the article "The cultural and evolutionary history of the real numbers" by Gallistel, Gelman and Cordes of UCLA and see what they say first.

Finally, the way you write, both Chinese and English, reminds me of one of our dear friends here. I even thought I was talking to him.







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12096
43#
發表於 15-2-23 22:04 |只看該作者
正如laorenjia所講,我地有個老朋友,有兩個modes,一個正常mode,好有見地;另一個係鬥爭mode,有時有道理,有時強詞奪理,目標只係鬥爭。

Rank: 2


72
44#
發表於 15-2-23 22:50 |只看該作者
本帖最後由 compsognathus 於 15-2-23 22:57 編輯

I myself believe that the mathematical concept of ratios had developed in humans long before natural or real numbers.

Many tribal cultures do not have many words for the natural numbers. For example, the Munduruku people only have words for one up until five. Studies done with Munduruku people show that they place numbers on the number line in a compressed, logarithmic form, so that the graph of their perceived distance between consecutive numbers resembles the graph of a logarithmic function. To a Munduruku, five dots is five times as great as one dot, but they notice that ten dots is twice as big as five dots, leading to this logarithmic graph.

A similar study performed using young children show that those without formal mathematics education mapped numbers identically to the manner in which Munduruku do so. As the child is introduced to the natural numbers and arithmetic, the curve slowly progresses into a straight line, the answer an educated adult would be most likely to give, provided the numbers were small. Even as adults, humans tend towards a logarithmic distribution of numbers, especially with larger numbers. For example, the terms “millionaire” and “billionaire” are thrown around almost as synonyms. When a similar study was carried out with adults, the adults showed logarithmic mapping when provided with amounts of dots too large to count quickly.

This concluded that humans have a predisposition to ratios rather than enumeration of individual numbers.

This is a rather logical deduction, as in the wild, circumstances would call for the application of ratios and proportions, not counting. When a tribal human sees two trees with fruit on them, he has to quickly deduce which of the trees bears more fruit. He does not need to individually enumerate the amount of fruit. When an enemy tribe is attacking the tribe of said human, he needs to be quickly able to deduce which of the tribes has more people, and therefore whether it is worth it to stand ground and fight or simply flee and avoid catastrophic losses. The ability to calculate ratios (though not necessarily express them in written form) is a survival skill in nature.

Another study involved a number of lionesses and a recording. One lioness was passing bushes, when a recording of one lioness roaring was played. The lioness stopped, looked around and moved on. When five lionesses passed by, three roars were played. The five lionesses roared in response and made an attack. This indicates that lions also have a concept of ratios, as they seem to recognize that a one-on- one fight was not worth it, but in greater numbers, they would readily fight.

To quote Stanislas Dehaene, "It appears that we, as humans, can access two different methods of numerical mapping. The logarithmic, ratio-based method is the most intuitive; we inherit it from our primate evolution and we still access it in the absence of precise mathematical tools. Through education, we also acquire a linear mapping. However, this does appear to be a cultural construct."

Sources:
1: Alex’s Adventures in Numberland (Alex Bellos)
2: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/05/080529141344.htm (Source: Harvard University)

Rank: 4


545
45#
發表於 15-2-23 23:01 |只看該作者

引用:+本帖最後由+laorenjia+於+15-2-17+16:10+

原帖由 laorenjia 於 15-02-17 發表
本帖最後由 laorenjia 於 15-2-17 16:10 編輯

妻子話我頭腦簡單,channel 同細路仔差唔多,若我講數細路 ...
原來我都係頭腦簡單的人,哈哈!
Laorenjia, 看了很多你的舊帖,學了很多,謝謝你!對於難溝通的人,不用太上心,希望你繼續教教我地呢d新手媽媽



Rank: 4


545
46#
發表於 15-2-23 23:08 |只看該作者

引用:正如laorenjia所講,我地有個老朋友,有兩

原帖由 eviepa 於 15-02-23 發表
正如laorenjia所講,我地有個老朋友,有兩個modes,一個正常mode,好有見地;另一個係鬥爭mode,有時有道理 ...
Evipa,我也很喜歡看你的帖,希望你都多d浦頭




347
47#
發表於 15-2-24 16:41 |只看該作者
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Rank: 7Rank: 7Rank: 7


12096
48#
發表於 15-2-24 17:07 |只看該作者
越睇越似老朋友嘅鬥爭mode。

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121812
49#
發表於 15-2-24 17:30 |只看該作者
小應該用D簡單D既方法, 總長32, 要可以用"平方尺"嚟計:

1. 應該只可以係四方形或者正方形
2. 不論係四方形或者正方形, 應該可只兩等份, 所以32既一半, 即係16就係長和濶既總和
3. 以16分為兩個數字, A和B, 計算A*B組合最大既一個, A,B為16既組合有:

1,15 (15 sq feet)
2,14 (28 sq feet)
3,13 (39 sq feet)
4,12 (48 sq feet)
5,11 (55 sq feet)
6,10 (60 sq feet)
7,9 (63 sq feet)
8,8 (64 sq feet)
還記得初為父母時,對孩子的期望嗎?我當時只想他/她平平安安,健健康康。
隨著時光飛逝,人的期望慢慢變了,變得越來越有要求。所以要經常提醒自己:毋忘初心
箴言4:23 - 你要保守你心,勝過保守一切,因為一生的果效是由心發出。
箴言22:6 - 教養孩童,使他走當行的道,就是到老他也不會偏離。

Rank: 5Rank: 5


1524
50#
發表於 15-2-24 17:48 |只看該作者
回覆 lamyeelok 的帖子

Not interested to continue, sorry.

Rank: 5Rank: 5


1524
51#
發表於 15-2-24 17:53 |只看該作者
BandC 發表於 15-2-23 23:01
原來我都係頭腦簡單的人,哈哈!
Laorenjia, 看了很多你的舊帖,學了很多,謝謝你!對於難溝通的人,不用太 ...

I value a good opponent and I do miss the discussion with Wicked in the following old post which I'm not sure if you have read as well.

http://www.edu-kingdom.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2270580&extra=&page=1

Rank: 6Rank: 6


6272
52#
發表於 15-2-24 18:21 |只看該作者
lamyeelok 發表於 15-2-24 16:41
不是我“assuming a lot of things”,而是你的理解力有限,係 assuming 我 "assuming a lot of things"而 ...
Exactly true!


347
53#
發表於 15-2-24 21:00 |只看該作者
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1524
54#
發表於 15-2-25 17:33 |只看該作者
本帖最後由 laorenjia 於 15-2-25 18:00 編輯

琴日—家去睇戲,賀歲片中除港產片外,就只剩慌失失企鵝未睇,因家人受我影響,都喜歡睇戲。其它戲都睇過,張就時間就連粵語版都殺啦。全場我哋係唯一成人組別,好多細路,妻子隔離嗰個得兩歲左右。企鵝彈吓彈吓佢就笑,企鵝跌出飛機佢就喊,但我都唔係好得幾多,老婆係咁叫我咪笑得咁大聲。我個人就係咁,掂吓啲細路仔嘢就會turn into the child mode. 為咗教女兒數學,我確費了一番苦心,硏究用算術方法而非代數方法教女兒高小算術。但不知為什麼,有些家長總覺得我的方法不正統,非要用代數方法甚至微積分不可。這些家長要嗎是沒有孩子,要嗎孩子都不用教。可惜我接觸的孩子小學時都沒有好奇心學—元二次方程或者微積分。我只能嘆一句,這些家長都離開小學日子太遠了,都已經忘了自己小學數學的日子是怎樣走過來的。說來奇怪,我幾年前對Judy的雞兔同籠問題提出非代數的將兔仔腳斬去的血腥算術解法也有些家長與這裏的家長差不多,在提不出他們所謂正確的算術解法的同時,老是用'right?','understand?'等empty-worded questions and condescending tone 同人講嘢。幾年過去,如出—轍。

http://www.edu-kingdom.com/forum ... 75529&extra=&page=2

由post no. 29 開始。

As I said then,  

Non-algebraic methods tend to more tedious than using equations but they tend to be more interesting as well.

It is always nice for a kid to master more advanced mathematical tools than those currently taught at school, but in no way this should be the requirement for all the students.

For example, in Mathematics at HKCE level, we are not supposed to use differentiation to find the minimum or maximum value of a quadratic function. The more tedious "completing the square" method is expected. Even in Additional Mathematics, to find the area of a triangle in coordinate geometry, one is not expected to use the more general, and much simpler "determinant" method learned in more advanced maths.

Rank: 6Rank: 6


6272
55#
發表於 15-2-25 20:52 |只看該作者
laorenjia 發表於 15-2-25 17:33
琴日—家去睇戲,賀歲片中除港產片外,就只剩慌失失企鵝未睇,因家人受我影響,都喜歡睇戲。其它戲都睇過, ...
Are you still dreaming???
HKCE???
Now is HKDSE!!!
Need to learn differentiation right???

Rank: 5Rank: 5


1524
56#
發表於 15-2-25 22:07 |只看該作者
本帖最後由 laorenjia 於 15-2-25 22:31 編輯
kenwong888 發表於 15-2-25 20:52
Are you still dreaming???
HKCE???
Now is HKDSE!!!

My dear friend
The guy dreaming definitely is not me. Pls read carefully. I was referringa to a post entry I wrote in 2007 when hkdse was nowhere close. And the last time I checked, core maths in hkdse still doesn't cover differentiation. RIGHT??? Finally pay attention to the main message other people are trying to convey, will you? RIGHT???

Rank: 7Rank: 7Rank: 7


12096
57#
發表於 15-2-25 22:23 |只看該作者
laorenjia 發表於 15-2-25 17:33
琴日—家去睇戲,賀歲片中除港產片外,就只剩慌失失企鵝未睇,因家人受我影響,都喜歡睇戲。其它戲都睇過, ...
laorenjia,

和你有點相似,我比較容易變成child mode,十年前對著年幼的女兒,可以聊天聊得大家都很高興,所以有時讓太太說我大唔透。不過,我正經起來,講家事國事天下事,太太卻搭不上咀來。自我陶醉一下,這可能叫做未失赤子之心。

我比較懶,懂得一種甚麼都能解的方法就不去理會低層次的方法。見你這幾個回合,我還很清楚記得當年你也是這樣,正想說你當年又是這樣,還未說出口,你自己就將當年的討論的論題列了出來。

講到長方形,相同邊界,長和闊甚麼比例面積會最大這問題,我在大概小五時,自己就想出了答案,肯定是正方形是面積最大。後來,六年級末段時學習座標的曲線,當中有例子介紹這問題,才知道長和闊不同比例可的形成一條曲線,亦證實了我的想法。

對高中孩子來說,明白正方形是面積最大,相信不難。


Rank: 6Rank: 6


6272
58#
發表於 15-2-25 22:32 |只看該作者
laorenjia 發表於 15-2-25 22:07
My dear friend
The guy dreaming definitely is not me. Pls read carefully. I was referring a post e ...
Both Module 1 & 2 include Calculus!!!
Still sleeping & dreaming right???

Rank: 5Rank: 5


1524
59#
發表於 15-2-25 22:54 |只看該作者
kenwong888 發表於 15-2-25 22:32
Both Module 1 & 2 include Calculus!!!
Still sleeping & dreaming right???

Dear dreaming friend

IT'S EXACTLY RIGHT!!!
M1 n M2 are called extended modules n are separate from so called Maths, RIGHT???

Rank: 5Rank: 5


1524
60#
發表於 15-2-25 23:05 |只看該作者
本帖最後由 laorenjia 於 15-2-26 00:10 編輯
eviepa 發表於 15-2-25 22:23
laorenjia,

和你有點相似,我比較容易變成child mode,十年前對著年幼的女兒,可以聊天聊得大家都很高興, ...

I actually feel pity for myself as if I am repeating part of my life, even possibly with the same people. And I saw the disappearance of some old friends like Wunma indicated by deleted entries in the old post and possibly judy. I feel agitated n sad suddenly. I never used punctuation marks like I just did, not even with wisekiddad n it  was with an unworthy opponent(I'm a snob after all as Wicked described in the old post). I pity myself.
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