學象棋與圍棋,邊樣好D?

ALAL

學象棋與圍棋,邊樣好D?

foolish.mom

octopusma,

香港兒童棋院 has the greatest number of students in HK. Seems that your boy would improve very quickly in 圍棋.  If it is the case, you can send me a PM or post after several months. I will introduce some good teachers for him.

foolish.mom

bbJP,

My boy is quite talented and he has great interest in 圍棋 (in fact all kinds of chess, mind games and strategy games). He is now 3-4 段

Octopusma

bbJP,
yes, 就係呢間喇, 唔該晒, 路過見到佢環境真係唔錯, 好RELAX好享受咁既感覺...

原帖由 bbJP 於 09-7-16 12:35 發表

e間好似叫'香港兒童棋院',係佐敦有一間一样既. 如果說兒童棋院,應該係最大既,環境都唔錯.

bbJP

原帖由 Octopusma 於 09-7-16 11:09 發表
foolish.mom,
如果佢話繼續學既, 我諗會帶佢去銅鑼灣聖保祿學校附近果間棋會, 我每星期帶阿仔游水時行過都見好多小朋友響入面捉棋, 但唔知果間叫咩名, 亦唔知好唔好,貴唔貴....

我仔連麻雀撲克牌都超鐘意, 打麻雀係 ...

e間好似叫'香港兒童棋院',係佐敦有一間一样既. 如果說兒童棋院,應該係最大既,環境都唔錯.

bbJP

原帖由 foolish.mom 於 09-7-14 23:42 發表
bbJP,

My kid is 12 years old. He has learnt 圍棋 for almost 4 years.

very good! 入段未?

Octopusma

foolish.mom,
如果佢話繼續學既, 我諗會帶佢去銅鑼灣聖保祿學校附近果間棋會, 我每星期帶阿仔游水時行過都見好多小朋友響入面捉棋, 但唔知果間叫咩名, 亦唔知好唔好,貴唔貴....

我仔連麻雀撲克牌都超鐘意, 打麻雀係識轉牌叫糊, 唔熟既人以為我爛賭tim呀, 但實情係我老豆開電腦俾佢玩明星3缺1, 諗住畫面不停郁, 佢細時用黎tum佢, 點知佢變左麻雀精....

原帖由 foolish.mom 於 09-7-15 22:01 發表
octopusma,

I can foresee that your son will love 圍棋 much after this summer. My kid also loved all kinds of chess and mind games before learning 圍棋. You will soon find out that he loves to go to t ...

[ 本帖最後由 Octopusma 於 09-7-16 11:13 編輯 ]

foolish.mom

tinmama,

I have no idea about chess school in Tsuen Wan. Do you mind going to Mongkok?

香港兒童圍棋學院

原帖由 tinmama 於 09-7-15 13:25 發表

請問知唔知荃灣邊度有得學圍棋呀??

foolish.mom

octopusma,

I can foresee that your son will love 圍棋 much after this summer. My kid also loved all kinds of chess and mind games before learning 圍棋. You will soon find out that he loves to go to the chess school, and it is easy to find someone to play with him there. My kid met many new friends in the chess school, and I can tell you that the parents in the chess school meet more often than parents in the primary school.

Tell me if it is the case after two months.

Octopusma

其實象棋定圍棋好, 大家又唔使太執著同爭論既, 我唔係棋人, 可能未必理解當中樂趣有咩分別, 但各有所好嘛...

我接觸棋完全因為阿仔, 阿仔幾歲人已經好鐘意捉棋, 好細個就要捉一d簡單1~100既跳棋, 大d就飛行棋, 再大d鬥獸棋, 5歲象棋, 基本上除左飛行棋我地有心機陪佢玩, 其他都冇乜心機陪佢, 但佢真係天生好有興趣, 連佢上yahoo網玩game都要搵棋黎捉...

佢未有正式上過任何棋班, 但因為太鐘意, 已經買左幾套象棋成日要我地陪佢捉, 知道爺爺識捉象棋, 一去爺爺度食飯就要帶埋去搵爺爺捉棋, 今年暑假幫佢報左個圍棋班, 又睇下佢自己是否鐘意(但都係佢自己要我報名的)...

我好認同象棋在香港好易搵到棋友一齊捉, 樂趣易搵好多, 是但一個阿公阿爺or長輩(公園阿伯)都可以捉餐飽, 圍棋較受家長歡迎, 也許就因為有比賽有級別, 個人認為部份家長們係個人虛榮多於真係從小朋友角度著想(當然只係一部份人呀), 任何課外活動, 以relax心態去學定係為級別比賽而學, 效果和意義已經完全唔同了.

是否捉棋就可以令小朋友腦筋靈活計數叻d, 確係有雞定有旦先既道理, 唔排除捉棋確係有其啟發性, 但感覺上對專注力既訓練更明顯...

以我個仔既情況, 完全係佢本人既興趣, 真係想迫都迫唔黎, 阿仔依家6歲, 呢排佢響window vista既遊樂場搵埋個國際象棋出黎玩, 屋企冇人識, 佢電腦對捉都玩餐飽, 攪到我都要學埋, 因為佢迫我陪佢玩...

[ 本帖最後由 Octopusma 於 09-7-15 15:20 編輯 ]

tinmama

原帖由 foolish.mom 於 09-7-14 23:42 發表
bbJP,

My kid is 12 years old. He has learnt 圍棋 for almost 4 years.

請問知唔知荃灣邊度有得學圍棋呀??

foolish.mom

bbJP,

My kid is 12 years old. He has learnt 圍棋 for almost 4 years.

bbJP

原帖由 foolish.mom 於 09-7-11 22:28 發表
This afternoon, my kid was beaten by his teacher, because he only predicted the 20 steps forward, but his teacher predicted 30 steps forward.

Your kid can predict 20+ moves, very good wor! How old is he?

foolish.mom

My conclusion is: both kinds of chess are good activities for kid. But chinese chess need not be learnt from a chess school. Usually parents or relatives teach the basic rules and they can starting playing. Most of the cases,  圍棋 has to be learnt in a chess school. After that, the kid will decide which one he likes more, and in fact, he can play both.

eviepa

原帖由 judy 於 09-7-11 13:00 發表
其實，不是学一樣嘢，將來都有所應用，以我教阿子學圍棋為例，我估佢成年後，80%以上唔会再捉。象棋也是一樣，除了公園阿伯，幾可見人捉。

阿大學打球，曾在学界拿獎，代表地區出賽，現在己不熱愛。我每星期租場打球，是為了讓他們有足够 ...

judy,

我同意妳以下的觀點：

1. 課外活動要視乎孩子的興趣。
2. 課外活動就算以後不要參與，在學習的過程還是有得益。

但往往孩子有多方面的興趣，不能一一都接觸。或者就算可以盡數讓孩子試試，但終歸都要選擇兩三種作重點培訓。

舉個例子，我當年學手球，學的時候有足夠的運動，亦可以訓練身手，練習團體精神。但問題是學完後，想繼續以此鍛煉身體、培養團隊精神就幾乎不可能了。

但我學羽毛球時，以後會不會繼續打球，卻完全由自己決定。不想打便不打。要打，便積極一點找人打，通街都是打羽毛球的人。所以在打羽毛球的二十多年裡，我幾乎無需刻意地找別的運動。

沒有人能保證兒女有一體一藝作為終身活動，但如果小朋友沒有甚麼偏好的，找一、兩項能夠持續發展的總是較冷門的好。

eviepa

eviepa

Foolish.mon,

象棋大國手在正常情況都不能預計十步以後的走法。一個資質普通的一段圍棋手很多時能算到二、三十著。結論：圍棋比較容易，象棋比較難。所以象棋比圍棋境界要高。是否合理推論？這個特點能否證明誰的境界較高？

現今香港，初中的男生，不論棋術如何，但很少不懂下象棋。但妳試做一個實驗，打電話去問一下親朋戚友的初中孩子，看看有多少個懂得下圍棋。

象棋是在家中學的，導師多是父母、親友。圍棋幾乎必要在學校、圍棋機構學，圍棋班看似比象棋班多，但小朋友懂得下象棋的人數是壓倒性的，從前如是，今天如是，眼見的將來也不可能會改變。

那間棋院每年的棋賽，每年的校際賽，我怎會不知。但妳知不知，第一、二屆的兒童圍棋大賽、校際賽有多少人、多少學校參加？實際數字是跌了非常多。而這家機構，由從前主辦校際賽變為今天的協辦，可見圍棋的熱潮其實是冷卻了。

eviepa

[ 本帖最後由 eviepa 於 09-7-12 01:01 編輯 ]

foolish.mom

eviepa,

Maybe counting 100 steps is an extreme case, but counting 20+ to 30 steps forward is common for 圍棋 players with 3 to 4 段.
This afternoon, my kid was beaten by his teacher, because he only predicted the 20 steps forward, but his teacher predicted 30 steps forward.

A children chess school holds 圍棋 chess tournament on Jaunary 1 every year. In recent years, there are more than 800 children participating. The interschool tournament attracts 60 - 70 schools for joining. You cannot say that 圍棋 is not popular among HK kids.

Mighty

Arent we comparing an apple with a pear?  Will it be closer to compare Chinese Chess with Chess as they are both represented by animals, knights and King/General etc?

eviepa

foolish.mom

二十年前看過一個則圍棋故事，有一個日本棋手，經幾小時長考（長時間思考一著棋），算到百多著後自己會輸少許，所以推抨認輸。這是極端例子，不過圍棋遠較象棋容易計算以後幾著、甚至十幾著是事實。

以我所知，就算是象棋高手，要準確算出前面五著也十分困難（注意，圍棋的計算法是我走一手棋是一著，你跟著應是另一著。象棋計法是我走一手棋，你應一手，加起來算是一著）。這是不同棋類的特性問題，而不能因此而判斷圍棋的境界較高。

我這生人花在圍棋的時間比象棋要少得多，但我下圍棋時，能預測前面幾著的能力卻遠比象棋為為高。

eviepa

foolish.mom

bbJP,

I agree completely with your comments on the advantages of 圍棋 over chinese chess.

eviepa,

At present, the most powerful computer program can challenge the world champion of chess or chinese chess. But the most powerful computer program can easily be beaten by a 圍棋 player with 段. It proves that 變化 of
圍棋 are much more than chinese chess.

For advanced 圍棋 players, it is usual to predict the following  20+ or even 30+ steps. Is is usual for chinese chess players to do the prediction up to 30 steps?