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續 有 家 長 反 對 加 費 英 基 明 日 解 畫 [複製鏈接]

medocb52

Rank: 2


96
1#
發表於 08-6-17 23:07 |只看該作者 |倒序瀏覽 |打印
[size=+1]續 有 家 長 反 對 加 費 英 基 明 日 解 畫
逾 三 百 名 英 基 家 長 聯 署 ， 反 對 校 方 下 學 年 加 學 費 ， 英 基 本 周 會 與 家 長 會 面 作 出 回 應 。
　　(星島日報報道)逾三百名英基學校協會的家長日前聯署，反對校方下學年加學費，昨日再有逾二十名家長加入聯署行動。

　　除加學費外，部分家長亦對英基行政甚多不滿，如有屬下中學要求所有家長付出逾萬元購買手提電腦，卻只可於校內使用。英基將於明日及後日舉行諮詢會，回應家長的意見。

　　英基早前宣布，中小學的學費將於下學年分別調高百分之五及百分之七，近三年累積加幅達一成四及兩成三，逾三百名英基家長日前發起聯署，反對學校加學費，並已向立法會教育事務委員會申訴。聯署行動聯絡人楊德忠表示，昨日再接到二十多名家長的電郵，響應聯署行動，當中有家長已決定下學年轉校，但也有聯署表達不滿。

　　他又指，
家長對英基行政亦有不滿，如有南島學校的家長指，校方要求所有家長付出逾萬元，購買手提電腦讓學生作學習及做功課之用，以減輕學生書包重量，但電腦只能於學校使用。有家長亦指，港島學校為讓教師參與國際文憑課程（IB）的培訓，逢周三均提早一小時下課，學生整學年便損失數十小時的課時。

　　楊德忠續稱，英基近年把不少課程外判，如性教育課程、科學活動等過往屬免費的活動，現時須收取數十元費用，「學校亦無講清楚情況，家長以為是額外課程，但原來不參加，學生那堂便無課可上，要到電腦室玩」。他指將約見教育局官員表達意見。

　　英基發言人重申，校方在加學費前經過廣泛諮詢，而校方本周將舉行兩場諮詢會，回應家長的關注事項。他並呼籲，家長若對學校行政有不滿，可通過現有渠道作反映，並應指出具體事實及證據，讓校方能作出跟進。


2008-06-17
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fitmum

Rank: 2


84
2#
發表於 08-6-17 23:34 |只看該作者
原文章由 medocb52 於 08-6-17 23:07 發表
續 有 家 長 反 對 加 費 英 基 明 日 解 畫 逾 三 百 名 英 基 家 長 聯 署 ， 反 對 校 方 下 學 年 加 學 費 ， 英 基 本 周 會 與 家 長 會 面 作 出 回 應  ...


ESF has never listened and they even claimed they never received any complaints on fee rise.  Shame on them.  Complaints were even filed last year by different parents.  Some did not write to them directly but were posted on SCMP last year.  This time we try to organise it better and we're seeing some reaction.

For the parents who want to speak out, there's still chance cause this is a long battle.

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fitmum

Rank: 2


84
3#
發表於 08-6-17 23:42 |只看該作者
原文章由 medocb52 於 08-6-17 23:07 發表
續 有 家 長 反 對 加 費 英 基 明 日 解 畫 逾 三 百 名 英 基 家 長 聯 署 ， 反 對 校 方 下 學 年 加 學 費 ， 英 基 本 周 會 與 家 長 會 面 作 出 回 應  ...


ESF has never listened and they even claimed they never received any complaints on fee rise.  Shame on them.  Complaints were even filed last year by different parents.  Some did not write to them directly but were posted on SCMP last year.  This time we try to organise it better and we're seeing some reaction.

For the parents who want to speak out, there's still chance cause this is a long battle.

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WYmom

Rank: 5Rank: 5


4747
4#
發表於 08-6-19 07:15 |只看該作者
They have more than enough funds to cover the increase in costs due to inflation and cannot justify the capital expenditure at all!  Very poor financial management!

英基家長抨「投資」無回報 (星島) 06月 19日 星期四 05:30AM
(綜合報道)

(星島日報報道)英基學校協會計畫於九月新學年，連續第三年調高學費，在逾三百名家長聯署反對下，英基昨舉行家長會「解畫」。行政總監杜茵妮承認英基下學年會有四千萬盈餘，但面對教師加薪、過去五年又被政府削資逾三千萬元，強調只要通脹持續，英基仍然面對財政壓力，未來將要再加學費。

　　暗示年年加學費

　　家長則批評，英基把學校當生意，利用學費投資興建私立獨立學校，但家長卻無分毫回報。

　　英基昨舉行家長諮詢會，行政總監杜茵妮與財務總監Robert Bennett向約見的四十名家長解釋加學費原因，雙方激辯近兩小時，期間火藥味甚濃，有家長激動指：「我的三個子女都讀英基，每個月一半人工都用來交學費，他們不可離開英基，因我無錢讀國際學校，又不能入主流學校，這是否逼我回澳洲？」

　　有家長批評，英基利用學費投資於轄下ESF Educational Services（ESL）的兩所私立獨立學校，但學生全無得益，「講到好像做生意般，但家長給錢學校投資，就完全無回報。」

　　杜茵妮解釋，英基向ESL提供的建校撥款屬借貸，須計算利息，由二千年至今約撥出二億四千萬元。她坦言，興建私校是她上任前的管理層決定，由於目前有大量學生輪候英基學位，有必要建新校。

　　發起三百名家長聯署反對加學費的家長楊德忠於會後表示，校方解釋未能令家長滿意，他們會要求教育局介入。記者 蔡瑤

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bbjan

Rank: 5Rank: 5


2581
5#
發表於 08-6-19 14:40 |只看該作者
we must speak out and act.

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bbsweet

Rank: 3Rank: 3


372
6#
發表於 08-6-20 12:17 |只看該作者
o甘RC既家長又可以點呀！是不是由得佢o地加呢

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Wingba

Rank: 2


56
7#
發表於 08-6-20 14:21 |只看該作者
My girl is studying in RC and the fee will be raised to HKD6,800 a month in the coming academic year.

No one wants any fee increase but it is equally absurd in refusing any increase amidst high inflation.

I am not aware that ESF pours a lot of its resources into ESF Educational Ltd. Neither do I know that RC has to pay back the funding with interest. Perhaps someone can share what exactly is the financial arrangement between ESF and RC and DC?

I am not a civil servant and every dollar of my girl's school fee is paid by me not the tax payers. I am also very sensitive to school fee increases. But I remember a saying that if you pay peanuts you get monkeys. The maximum increase of school fee should be the same as inflation rate. Of course, the lower, the better.

ESF should pay more attention to financial management especially the RoI of its funding. If it can achieve 50% of what Harvard did in managing its asset we should not be worried about fee increase.

Please share your thoughts, insights, opinions and most importantly, insider information, if any.

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play

Rank: 3Rank: 3


153
8#
發表於 08-6-20 15:38 |只看該作者
ESF finances to face scrutiny by officials

Miranda Shek

Friday, June 20, 2008

Education chiefs are to examine the financial plans of the besieged English Schools Foundation before they decide on the organization's application to increase tuition fees. The Education Bureau admitted yesterday that it was alarmed by the recent row between the ESF and parents who have accused the organization of channeling money into its private independent schools - Discovery College and Renaissance College. In a written reply to The Standard, the bureau said it "will not approve ESF's investment plans per se, but will look at its financing plans including investment in capital projects in the context of its overall budget when examining its fee proposal."
[img]http://203.80.0.221/openx-2.4.6/www/delivery/lg.php?bannerid=88&campaignid=56&zoneid=4&loc=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thestandard.com.hk%2Fnews_detail.asp%3Fpp_cat%3D11%26art_id%3D67495%26sid%3D19447192%26con_type%3D1&referer=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.thestandard.com.hk&cb=442f06cb5a[/img]
Officials refused to elaborate but said the government provided ESF primary schools with HK$115 million in subsidies, or HK$20,500 per student in 2007/08. For secondary schools, the government's subsidies amounted to HK$176 million, or HK$28,480 for each student. In meetings held with ESF management on Wednesday and last night, parents repeatedly asked for an explanation as to why the school had poured HK$80 million of its reserves to fund the building of private independent schools. They said the investment plans did not benefit their children. ESF chief executive Heather Du Quesnay said the organization needed to "have a vision for the future, not just for the current day." But this failed to appease parents. The ESF wants fees to rise by 7 percent to HK$58,100 per year at primary schools and 5 percent to HK$89,250 at secondaries. Hong Kong Education Policy Concern Group chairman Mervyn Cheung Man-ping called for transparency and a clearer mechanism to deal with tuition fee increase applications in ESF and directly subsidized schools. "The ESF has enjoyed privileged treatment from the Education Bureau and it receives 30 percent of its funding from the government. The bureau should have stronger representation on the ESF's governing board," he said. Albert T Yeung, whose two children have been attending ESF schools for 10 years, urged the bureau to seriously monitor the ESF's governance. "The government has failed to monitor the ESF, and it has been greatly unfair to our children as subvention to ESF students has decreased despite skyrocketing inflation in recent years."

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JJ_Mom

Rank: 1


28
9#
發表於 08-6-20 16:10 |只看該作者

Where did the subsidies HK$20,500 per student in 2007/08 go?

RC primary student (without subsidy) will be paying $6,800 per month per head.  Subsidised ESF primary student will be paying $5,810 per month....the difference is $990 per head.  

Subsidised ESF student will be paying $990 less than the two non-subsidised schools whereas the gov't has granted $2,050 per month per head (assuming the 2007/08 figure unchanged).  Where did the $1,060 per month per head of subsidy go??????  Parents of the subsidised ESF students are paying $10,600 more than they should in a year.

This doesn't make sense at all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:-D

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daydream


337
10#
發表於 08-6-20 16:18 |只看該作者
提示: 作者被禁止或刪除 內容自動屏蔽

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JJ_Mom

Rank: 1


28
11#
發表於 08-6-20 17:10 |只看該作者
Quoting info from the Discovery College web site....."there is no recurrent annual grant being provided to the new school by the HKSAR Government, i.e. student places are not ‘sub-vented' in the way that other ESF schools are. As a result, Discovery College is operated by ESF Educational Services Limited, a part of ESF."  


Without the subvention, and with lower "recurrent resources available"....this school managed to have the campus built with "minimised obstruction of sea views", "Gymnasium, Sports Hall, Performing Arts Centre, Swimming Pool, Drama Studios etc." and "the primary students having access to specialist facilities, such as the laboratories and workshops and to other major amenities like the information resource center/library, gymnasium, swimming pool, performing arts center and the cafeteria."  

Oh yeah.....with the existing allocation methdology of the subvention, some private school students gets much more than they paid for........and others pay more and get less?   
:-D

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daydream


337
12#
發表於 08-6-20 17:26 |只看該作者
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WYmom

Rank: 5Rank: 5


4747
13#
發表於 08-6-20 18:44 |只看該作者

回覆 #1 daydream 的文章

ESF Centre also administers /manages RC and DC, yet  no recurring overhead cost of the Centre is allocated to RC/ DC.  All ESF Centre cost is paid by parents of ESF schools.  Besides, the funds loaned to RC and DC is charged at a very low interest rate (HIBOR+1%? I did not remember exactly).  The funds came from school fees of ESF schools in the past years.  There is no service fee paid back to ESF.

Teacher-student ratio: 1:30 in ESF primary, but 1:26 in RC,

Re Fees - ESF primary is only $1K (per month) lower than RC, and for secondary, they are even almost the same ($9K per month)!!

So RC's students are enjoying more resources in terms of teachers' ratio, campus facilities and ESF mgt Centre.

[ 本文章最後由 WYmom 於 08-6-20 21:53 編輯 ]

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fitmum

Rank: 2


84
14#
發表於 08-6-21 00:51 |只看該作者
Please help me to clarify cause I'm very confused with these figures now.

During the meetings (18th and 19th), the finance guy from ESF stated the govt subvention for '07-'08 is $17,000 per primary student.  That means each ESF is charging each primary student  $54,300 + $17,000 = $71,300/year but RC is charging only $68,000/year.

But on this quote, subvention is $20,500/student.  How did this discrepancy occur?

Isn't it rediculous ESF students are paying more than PIS?



原文章由 play 於 08-6-20 15:38 發表
ESF finances to face scrutiny by officials

Miranda Shek

Friday, June 20, 2008

Education chiefs are to examine the financial plans of the besieged English Schools Foundation before they decide on  ...

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Twolovelyboys

Rank: 2


85
15#
發表於 08-6-21 05:13 |只看該作者
I will be sending my son to a PIS school this autumn and like any normal human being I would like to pay as least as possible for school fees.  

We currently live in the UK and I alway say to myself how lucky the people of HK are for having subsidy/subvention  for private international school.  Here in the UK the fess for an average level international school is about HK$150,000pa with some top level elite private school being above $300,000pa.  

Correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand ESF was set up because HK was a former British colony and the subvention was used to provide assistance to expatriates living in Hong Kong for a "modern liberal education" .  After 1997 with HK now under 'Chinese rule' and the majority of expats returning to their home country (and as I read in some web acticles the majority of ESF students are Chinese HK residents), its might  be time to stop the subvention altogether.  Maybe that will stop all this bickering about "How ESF students fees/subvention are used to in subsidising PIS schools".

Another way of looking at it is this, my son speaks little chinese and was offered an interview and a place at Shatin Junior School within a couple of months after his application.  I decided not to accept the offer because of the location and decided to let my son go to an "ESF" run PIS School.  By turning down the offer I am now having to pay and extra HK$10,000pa for my son's education but at the same time free up a school place for a "would be ESF student".  Does that mean the parent of the "would be ESF student" should thank me because I've given up the school place for them and subsidies HK$10,000 of my money so that their son could attend SJS.

There is always two sides to an argument .  ESF students are paying $HK54,3000 and RC students are paying HK$68,000, I may not be good at maths but logic tells me HK$68,000 is greater than HK$54,300, so how can one say ESF students are paying more than PIS.

I think people should not take things for granted and thank their lucky stars for being able to live in hk and pay one of the lowest fees in the world for private international education.

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iamfine

Rank: 3Rank: 3


296
16#
發表於 08-6-21 07:55 |只看該作者
原文章由 Twolovelyboys 於 08-6-21 05:13 發表
I will be sending my son to a PIS school this autumn and like any normal human being I would like to pay as least as possible for school fees.  

We currently live in the UK and I alway say to myself  ...


Thanks Twolovelyboys for such reasoned arguments.  Welcome back to Hong Kong.

You pay peanuts, you get monkeys.  It is as simple as that.  I do not want to sound mean or arrogant, but the fact remains that internaional schools and private independent schools are relatively inexpensive in Hong Kong.  Check the rates elsewhere.  I am currently paying almost GBP7,800 per school term (there are 3 terms in a year) for my son's education in the UK.  One of my friends who has been seconded to Shanghai is spending over $HK$15,000 on her son education (primary) there.  I am not an ESF parent and have no idea how good or bad ESF is managing its finance, but  I for one feel happy that there are ESF schools here.

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WYmom

Rank: 5Rank: 5


4747
17#
發表於 08-6-21 09:49 |只看該作者
This is not a topic to compare fee with UK schools.  Different countries have different systems.  

We are discussing on the use of ESF school fees to build more and more independent private schools without reasonable return to ESF, increase of fees by 23% in 3 years while inflation rate in these 3 years is far below this!  Besides, bulk of increase will be going to IT expenses, recruitment of more HR and accounting staff, dental scheme of staff, just only a small part of it is for employment of EAs for year 3.  Is it really necessary and reasonable?

After channeling $240M to RC and DC in the last 2 years, ESF will obviously say that the increase in the next few years will have to be a lot more when they redevelop KJS, KGV and Island School .  The funding of redevelopment or investment in PIS should not mainly come from school fees, they should be financed by endowment and/or other financial arrangement such as sponsorship, alumni fundings etc.  This is a common practice in many other schools in HK or in other countries.  Would it be too easy a job for the management to just ask existing parents to pay more and more whenever they need more funds?

[ 本文章最後由 WYmom 於 08-6-21 09:55 編輯 ]

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fitmum

Rank: 2


84
18#
發表於 08-6-21 12:19 |只看該作者
Very funny a lot of people see ESF as JUST a private international school serving rich expats.

ESF is set up as a charitable educational organisation to provide affordable English education to non-Chinese speaking children in HK.  Many families are just hard-working middle class that don't drive expensive European cars or stay at 5-star hotels on vacations.  Don't just think everybody is from UK; some are from East Asia also.  For the really rich people, they won't pick ESF cause the facilities are not nice enough.  Most buildings are very old and even toilets stink.  

Don't middle class families deserve to enjoy subsidy from the govt?  We all pay our dues too.  

We are asking ESF to control their spending.  By reading their budgeting reports, it takes no expert to see there r lots of spooky things and that's why we ask questions and help from the govt to intervene (because ESF management is a stone wall).






原文章由 Twolovelyboys 於 08-6-21 05:13 發表
I will be sending my son to a PIS school this autumn and like any normal human being I would like to pay as least as possible for school fees.  

We currently live in the UK and I alway say to myself  ...

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hhy2007

Rank: 4


571
19#
發表於 08-6-21 15:12 |只看該作者
The purpose for ESF to invest in RC and DC is to generate revenues for itself.  ESF parents should thank RC and DC for being ESF's cash cows.

As to the subvention, considering the fact that ESF parents don't pay more taxes than PIS parents, and the fact that ESF students are not superior than other students in HK, why do ESF students have the privilege of being entitled to the subvention?

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WYmom

Rank: 5Rank: 5


4747
20#
發表於 08-6-21 15:32 |只看該作者
原文章由 hhy2007 於 08-6-21 15:12 發表
The purpose for ESF to invest in RC and DC is to generate revenues for itself.  ESF parents should thank RC and DC for being ESF's cash cows.

As to the subvention, considering the fact that ESF pare ...


Absolutely wrong.  See how much is given to ESL and how much is given back as quoted below.  If treat it as a business, it is definitely running at a huge loss.  Have you read any financials before saying this?

英基行政總裁認從未減薪
家長質疑教師增薪非加學費主因		2008年6月21日
【明報專訊】英基學校協會家長反對校方加學費，風波愈鬧愈大。有家長質疑，英基合約教員2003至04年度需減薪一成，至今薪金仍未追回03年前水平，但教師減薪同時，部分管理層卻未受影響，英基學校協會行政總裁杜茵妮更承認，自己從未被減薪。
英基學校協會前晚就學費提高的問題，與30多名家長舉行第二場諮詢會。對於杜茵妮一直強調，加學費的主因是教師薪酬不斷提升，家長聯署發起人楊德忠卻指出，教師薪酬曾在03至04年度下調10%，近年雖加薪，但仍未回復當年水平。前晚諮詢會上杜茵妮被問及曾否減薪時，她直言包括自己在內的部分行政人員，從沒有被減薪，家長質疑，教師加薪並不是英基加學費主因。
另外，楊德忠又指出，英基未能解釋與其轄下投資機構ESF Educational Services(ESL)千絲萬縷的關係。ESL協助英基籌建轄下兩所私立獨立學校，並收取690萬元顧問費，但至今暫時回報僅220萬，ESL總監之位亦是杜茵妮兼任。楊德忠質疑，英基投資是否明智及有否牽涉利益關係，並指家長代表已約見教育局官員申訴。
兼任投資機構總監受質疑
英基學校協會傳訊總監郭彼德表示，所有問題已在諮詢會上解釋清楚。他說，杜茵妮04年入職，而受減薪影響的只限於03年或以前入職的員工，因此她從沒有被減薪。又指ESL是非牟利機構，負責協助英基籌劃各種課外活動，與英基有很多財政往來，「ESL協助英基投資興建兩所私立獨立學校，繳付顧問費是理所當然的。我們都一直強調，兩所私立獨立學校是長線投資，日後必有回報」。
教育局發言人則表示，會繼續留意事件，並鼓勵英基繼續與家長保持溝通。



[ 本文章最後由 WYmom 於 08-6-21 15:34 編輯 ]

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