派不到M1 或M2數

雙儿

原帖由 BookloverJ 於 11-7-23 08:50 發表


我諗你既認知係錯既, 無論邊張paper, Maths 比起 Amaths. 都係淺易好多.

"Look at the % of getting grade A in maths and additional maths. Arguably, it is more difficult to get an A in maths than in addi ...

Everyone knows the topics of additional maths are more advanced than maths, including me. I'm not referring to the adsolute difficulty of the questions in the paper per se. When I say a paper is easy or difficult, I refer to the relative difficulty in getting a good grade.

But some questions in section B of maths paper are close to impossible under exam conditions. For example, among the students I know who got A in maths, none of them attempted the question of circles in section B.

Maths paper is a compulsory paper and is therefore bound to comprise some idiot questions for less able students, but it does not mean everyone can get a good grade. After all, only around 4% of candidates get an A, it can hardly be described as an "easy" subject. If the percentage of getting an A(A*) was close to 30% like maths under IGCSE, I would call it easy.

[ 本帖最後由 雙儿 於 11-7-23 17:51 編輯 ]

雙儿

原帖由 khmama524 於 11-7-23 10:30 發表
雙儿 , please check pm.  Thanks!

Answered. Usually my advice comprises two parts: the factual part, which I try every bit to be correct, and the opinion part, which, as you may now know, is full of personal biases. You can of course choose to ignore them (but at your peril).

[ 本帖最後由 雙儿 於 11-7-23 18:12 編輯 ]

snowbell

我意思是指多出的10個人，數學分底都高,可承接M1,M2的課程, 而不能選的話, 太可惜.

由小五,小六的呈分試都知遊戲規則, 但選科會直接影響學生升讀大學的選科及海外升學.


升上高中的學生, 思想上會比初中時成熟, 想發奮上進的學生, 如無M1,M2, 總覺抹殺他們的機會, 最低限度比M1他們試.
F.4 - F.6 兩年半的時間, 轉變可以很大.

cow

原帖由 雙儿 於 11-7-23 17:44 發表
Everyone knows the topics of additional maths are more advanced than maths, including me. I'm not referring to the adsolute difficulty of the questions in the paper per se. When I say a paper is easy or difficult, I refer to the relative difficulty in getting a good grade.

In terms of absolute difficulty and the difficulty to get a good grade. A.Maths is more difficult than Maths.

For the same batch of students taking A.Maths and Maths, the percentage of students getting good grades in Maths must be greater than that in A. Maths.

[ 本帖最後由 cow 於 11-7-23 22:59 編輯 ]

eviepa

如果孩子是最強的十個八個巴仙學生，平日非常勤力，喜歡接受挑戰，選修M1M2自然如虎添翼。

但不幸地，你們的子女是border line case的三四十個巴仙的能力，能否入U，端視乎未來幾年的造化的話，選不選修M1M2就要想清楚了。

小弟中學時雖然未讀過A Maths，但知道這個水平的微積分、代數、統計學是個無底深潭。有可能讀一科所需的時間（所需時間多少，很視乎學生IQ），等於幾倍歷史、地理等科所需的時間。

如果不讀M1M2，將所騰出來的時間用作溫習別的科目，能入大學的機會較大。讀M1M2，如果入到U，成績又好的話，選科的範圍是闊了。如果本來入到U，但因為讀M1M2佔用太多溫習時間，導致入不了，則是得不償失。

M1M2有多大用處？

不讀M1M2，也有很多好科目選，比如說法律、醫學。另外，商學院、理學院、文學院、社會科學院…也有很多很多科目可以選。

論日常生活、做事，M1M2幾乎完全沒有用。小弟雖然學過M1M2深度的微積分、代數、統計學，但記憶中離開學校後就已經從未用過。

雙儿

Dear fellows,

It is not that obvious if you look at the statistics. From 2010 HKCEE exam report, 87.4% of candidates passed additional maths while 75.2% passes maths. I do understand there are arts students for maths paper, but I remain to be convinced that a subject with 87.4% passing rate is the more difficult paper, if we are referring to the difficulty of getting a good grade.

I am far away from my exam days. My opinion is based on discussion with my daughter when she took HKCEE.

BookloverJ, obviously it is not just one question happening to be more difficult. I was told AS, GS (we called them AP, GP in our days), linear programming can be quite tricky and time consuming as well. Go to a book store and pick up a reference book (either DSE or HKCEE if you can still find one) for the questions. Anyway, my point is not on the absolute difficulty of the questions. "因為以前會考Maths真very very easy, 好多同學一半時間唔使就做哂. "--Did they all get A with half of the allotted time to check their work?

I referred to the A* percentage of IGCSE is just to illuminate what I mean by "easy", i.e. the degree of easiness to get a good grade. Of course, it is totally up to you to consider a paper with 4% candidates getting an A as "very, very easy". You can see the A% of other subjects in HKEAA exam report as well. Google it please.

[ 本帖最後由 雙儿 於 11-7-24 10:30 編輯 ]

雙儿

原帖由 eviepa 於 11-7-24 09:48 發表
如果孩子是最強的十個八個巴仙學生，平日非常勤力，喜歡接受挑戰，選修M1M2自然如虎添翼。

但不幸地，你們的子女是border line case的三四十個巴仙的能力，能否入U，端視乎未來幾年的造化的話，選不選修M1M2就要想清楚了。

小弟 ...

I agreed with all you said except the last paragraph. It really depends on what your job is but statistics is everywhere and one should learn some, M1 or not. 我呢個女人仔上呢吹水都時不時要用到啲 statistics 啦。

cow

雙儿,

Don't use statisitc to fool yourself.
For those people taking A.Maths and Maths. Properly they will get the follwing grades:
Maths (A), A.Maths (A-D)
Maths (B), A.Mahts (A-D)
Maths (C), A.Mahts (D-fail)
Mahts (D), A.Mahts (E-fail)

In my old day, over 3/4 of my classmates got A in Maths but less than 1/2 got A in A.Maths. Over 90% got A-B in Maths but the figure is much lower in A.Maths. All got A-C in Maths but not all could get A-C in A.Maths.

If you want to use statistic:
Grade A in GCE AS English (10%)
Grade 7 in IBDP A1 SL English (~4%)
Grade A in HKU UE (less than 2%)
Don't tell me that HKU UE is the most difficult. In fact, IBDP A1 English is the most difficult.

You can also compare the IGCSE O Level English as 1st language with the one for 2nd language.

雙儿

原帖由 cow 於 11-7-24 12:22 發表
If you want to use statistic:
Grade A in GCE AS English (10%)
Grade 7 in IBDP A1 SL English (~4%)
Grade A in HKU UE (less than 2%)
Don't tell me that HKU UE is the most difficult. In fact, IBDP A1 English is the most difficult.

If the profiles of the candidates taking IB and UE are similar and if Grade 7 in IB equals to grade A in UE(I'm not sure about both), I can tell you flatly UE is more difficult with a lower A%.

雙儿

原帖由 cow 於 11-7-24 12:22 發表
Maths (C), A.Mahts (D-fail)
Mahts (D), A.Mahts (E-fail)

If your memory does not fail you, your classmates in this category are absolute lazy bones. Anyone with some preparation can pass additional maths (87% passing rate, omg). A totally unprepared student can tackle maths reasonably well as a majority of the questions in maths paper are pretty much basic as you guys said and covers materials of the whole secondary school. The qualities required for an A in additional maths are slightly different from those for an A in maths. And sure I can tell you numerous examples with their additional maths grader higher than maths grades.

Just use another example, the topics of AP Calculus or GCE A level maths are more advanced than HKCEE additional maths. They are easier in the sense that over 20% of the candidates get the top grade.

By the way, you need some more work to reconcile the figures of your class with the overall statistics.

And Cow, pay attention to the words I used. I used the word "arguably", not "categorily", in my first post. Mind the difference. I usually choose my words carefully even though they look casual sometimes. My original point was just that maths was not an "easy" paper as normally thought.

[ 本帖最後由 雙儿 於 11-7-24 13:19 編輯 ]

snowbell

雖然大學某些科沒有指定要M1,M2,  但interview時有M1,M2又考得好,  會不會優勝些?

我自己沒有修A.Maths, 但問理科的人就話易, 問文科的人就話難.  難同易真係見仁見智, 識既就話易, 唔識就話難.

但起碼知文憑試Maths, 最高境界是Core , M2取盡分.
用最高的point, 再量力而為, 退而求其次, 由學校編排,
所以現在F.1到F.3都唔易讀, 尤其F.3, 要讀書的學生真係唔好hea.

[ 本帖最後由 snowbell 於 11-7-24 14:13 編輯 ]

cow

雙儿,

You have to admit that you have given wrong analysis to your daughter if you have told her that studying A.Maths is easier to get a good grade than studying Maths.

Obviously you are not the one who took both Maths and A.Maths in HKCEE. Ask someone who has taken both subjects and you will get an answer. Actually you have got your answer already - the profiles of the candidates taking A.Maths and Maths are different.

By the way all of my classmates passed A.Maths.  

2010 HKCEE Grade A/5* percentage
English 1.2%
Literature in English 7%
Maths 3.4%
A.Maths 6.0%

2010 HKCEE Grade A-C/5*-4 percentage
English 17.3%
Literature in English 39.2%
Maths 28%
A. Maths 39%

[ 本帖最後由 cow 於 11-7-24 19:55 編輯 ]

gigivinda

原帖由 snowbell 於 11-7-24 13:58 發表
雖然大學某些科沒有指定要M1,M2,  但interview時有M1,M2又考得好,  會不會優勝些?
...

Although there is no past experience, to a certain extent, if two persons are similar in other aspects but one has taken M1/M2 and has got a good result but the other has not taken M1/M2, I think the former will have some advantage.  It is just like HKCEE, only 6 subjects are counted but if one has 10As (or even just 7As) but the other has 6As, I think the former will have advantage over the latter.

[ 本帖最後由 gigivinda 於 11-7-24 19:41 編輯 ]

mio8390

從以前到現在，都不是每個達到最低要求者都能入選，因為不能有足夠學位滿足到所有人，這個遊戲全世界都是這個玩法。
還有是大部份學校都是中五才開始讀M1或M2，得一年半時間，追是十分困難，其它科目也十分忙，讀多科未必是好事。

原帖由 snowbell 於 11-7-23 18:30 發表
我意思是指多出的10個人，數學分底都高,可承接M1,M2的課程, 而不能選的話, 太可惜.

由小五,小六的呈分試都知遊戲規則, 但選科會直接影響學生升讀大學的選科及海外升學.


升上高中的學生, 思想上會比初中時成熟, 想發 ...

snowbell

原帖由 mio8390 於 11-7-24 21:26 發表
從以前到現在，都不是每個達到最低要求者都能入選，因為不能有足夠學位滿足到所有人，這個遊戲全世界都是這個玩法。
還有是大部份學校都是中五才開始讀M1或M2，得一年半時間，追是十分困難，其它科目也十分忙，讀多科未必是好事。
...

囝囝的學校大半數學生要修8科，聽師兄說M1,M2由中四開始教.

ANChan59

原帖由 snowbell 於 11-7-24 22:29 發表
囝囝的學校大半數學生要修8科，聽師兄說M1,M2由中四開始教.

For clarification only, 8 subjects - Core Maths & M1/M2 as one subject or two.

If my son stayed in NSS, he might take Chinese, English, Maths (Core + M2 = 1), LS, Chemsitry, Physics, and Economics. They considered that as 7 subjects.

mio8390

政府規定第八科一定不可是學術科(例如是 : 音樂或體育.....等等)因為新高中學制是比以前高中深，所以政府不見意學太多科目。
M1和M2不是每間學校都是由中四開始，因為課程比較深，所以有些學校在中五時才開始M1與M2課程。

原帖由 snowbell 於 11-7-24 22:29 發表


囝囝的學校大半數學生要修8科，聽師兄說M1,M2由中四開始教.

judy

統計好好玩：阿大和两個表哥考会考，阿大考10科，大表哥考9科，二表哥考8科，三人奪A數目相同。爺爺於是宣佈，二表哥最叻，得A率最高，大表哥次之，阿大排最尾。激死阿大。

讀文科的人，常羨慕理科奪Ａ高，10A，9A，8A差不多給理科的奪走。其實佢地忘記一樣嘢，香港地，成績好的，幾乎全選理科(幾家名女校可能除外)，再頂尖才考附加數。如果成績差的一批選理科，理科奪Ａ率肯定大降，理所當然。

講開M1，M2。我認為两科難易不在同一層次。統計一科，最深的部分，預科根本不会教，我估普通學生，用心讀一定過骨。反而M2部分，難度介乎附加數和純數之間，我估大部分学生，連入门也難，小心。