教育王國
標題: Failure of ESF assessment and monitoing system [打印本頁]
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-20 12:57 標題: Failure of ESF assessment and monitoing system
I would like to share my case showing failure of ESF assessment and monitoring system (traffic light) in the subject of Spanish.
My son studes Spanish in year 8 in ESF school. His grades were rated A* in first and second terms. He has extra-tuition for Spanish out of school. In the parent-teacher meeting, the Spanish teacher told me my son had excellent progress in Spanish. But some how, my son was given grade C in overall grade in school report. I couldn't find any evidence or test result which supported grade C. I emailed the Spanish teacher and he did not reply me. I checked the schoiol website and he is one of the senior staff in the school. My son was told in the class the grade would not be changed.
I am not an aggressive parent and this is the first time (and the last tme) I wrote to the subject teacher and asked the reason why my son got the poor grade. There is no other easy way I can communicate with the teacher if he does not reply my email. (In fact I don't want to waste my time if I go to see him in person).
The ESF assessment and monitoring system in Gateway completely failed in my son's case. It would be a horrible case if my son is rated grade A* in Gateway not until he gets grade C in IGCSE exam in year 11 !
To turn thing positive, I will ask my son to study hard for Spanish and he should deserve A or above in coming new school. I truely believe my son has ability to learn better Spanish.
作者: sschiu 時間: 14-6-20 14:35 標題: 回覆：Choisumwong 的帖子
There must be some reasons why grade C was given at the end. Has your son tried to talk to the teacher at school?
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-20 15:06
回覆 sschiu 的帖子
You are right. My son tried to ask his teacher in past two weeks. But he didn't get his answer because his teacher was absent last week and was in a hurry this week. I do guess there is possibility of something wrong with my son. Anyway, the teacher should reply me and give me answer becasue obviiously there is huge discrepancy in performance and outcome.
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-20 20:15
唔好咁心急，偶然寫錯入錯資料，很平常。改番就得，没大影響的。重要是孩子真有料。好好溝通便會明白。
作者: Mighty 時間: 14-6-20 22:21
Are you a parent of Shatin College? My daughter is going to Y7 this September. I had a question and I sent an email to one of the teachers in college (who I thought was in charge). While I had to wait for 3 days, I had a well explained reply from the Vice Principal of Faculty of Language.
In my case, it was just a general question and it took them 3 days to reply. So do not get upset. You should pursue for an answer not just because you need to find out why, more importantly is to be better prepared for IGCSE in Y11.
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-20 22:30
回覆 annie40 的帖子
Thanks. I highly respect and forgive the teacher if it is his mistake. I waited for two weeks for my son to approach the teacher. The final grade is not important for my son in this school. It is not a big deal at all. What I want to point out is that the assessment system, communication and feedback system in ESF are failures. Some teachers are giving random grades which can not be detected by the systems. Parents have no proper way to reflect their opinions to the teachers especially at the end of year.
作者: hkparent 時間: 14-6-20 22:36 標題: 引用：回覆+annie40+的帖子
Thanks.+I+highly+re
原帖由 Choisumwong 於 14-06-20 發表
回覆 annie40 的帖子
Thanks. I highly respect and forgive the teacher if it is his mistake. I waited ...
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-20 22:48
回覆 Mighty 的帖子
I would say 3 days is too long for a very simple question. I would accept the reply that the teacher needs somtime to investigate my son's case and turn back to me later. The obvious poor grade highly indicates humam error and possibility of inflexbility for Gateway to correct any input data. My son did send email to him two weeks ago and asked for double-check. I will wait patiently for possible reply if any.
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-20 22:52
回覆 hkparent 的帖子
In parent-teacher meeting, he told me my son had excellent progress in Spanish !
Sorry, student handbook is no use in this school.
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-20 23:30
其實大部份老師很合作，只是溝通問題而已。小女的成績表也曾被寫錯grade,告假兩天變成十一天。後來才知道阿女遅到一點卻忘記去簽簿，當天就當缺課了，反正學校沒表示不滿，就由得個record不變。至於寫錯grade,孩子提醒老師就可以，今期修改有點麻煩，通常下期會更正。
我的經驗是拜託孩子辦事(例如找老師），他們一般只用三分力，一兩次搵唔到便算，因為光陰寶貴，要跟同學hea嘛。所以他們說完全找不到之說，我會有保留。反正西班牙老師始終會來上課，孩子一定有機會反映意見的(除非忘記了。）小女周時會忘記，故此我要按小人之心來推測，請諒！
孩子是year8，成績單上的錯漏，對未來的評核影響不大（除非要馬上轉校。）因此免麻煩，又或避免老師以為「我是亞洲第一虎媽」，我都會好客氣咁講咗就算，唔會啄住要佢改正。
除了科目老師，還有一位是year head,可以cc email比佢跟進，順便很關心的問侯阿西班牙老師去咗邊處？另外應該去Admin dept認識一兩位友善staff，有何事幹，也應cc一份給友好，問下究竟誰是負責人，找對人，反應快得多。
我那間的校長有點行政人員feel，記得曾出notice話，家長任何詢問，老師必於48小時內回复，逾時未獲回复者，可直接搵校長處理。（係咪有點像從前大機構答應電話玲聲響兩聲以內必有人接聽的服務承諾呢！）
中學比小學大得多，家長亦少了到訪，難怪會有「豪門深海」之歎。凡事溝通，找到對口單位（舊式幹部用語），萬事大吉！
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-21 09:51
回覆 annie40 的帖子
Thanks for your advice. Your kid's school administration completely makes sense. In my case, I feel that the feedback system is not good. My son even does not care the grade. I am not tiger parent, but is eager to find out problem of my kid and sort out early.
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-21 13:44
完全理解妳的frustration. 自己也經歷過不少。經乎想快些趕走個老師，后來溝通清楚，原來是小事而已。而這位老師成為小女其中一位生命𥚃的mentor。等一等，前面原來是「驚喜.」。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-21 15:27
回覆 annie40 的帖子
現在好老師難求。小兒不想我找老師說清楚只是擔心會被老師在堂上責罵。這位老師可能是傳統父親型的老師。其實小兒西班牙文這個不一致的等級反影個別老師的問題。溝通是很重要，如果學校沒有給家長有充分的溝通，實在會有很多誤會及不滿。學校只是每年給五分鐘直接見到老師，但是到年末就只得到一個報告。這樣的一個制度我受不了！
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-21 17:13
我的學校有特定的tutor老師，跟足孩子五年，每五個星期跟孩子約談十五分鐘，分享少年維特的煩惱，小女的dynasty喜歡這位mentor極了。少女心事，老師知道不少。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-22 10:31
回覆 annie40 的帖子
似乎你的小朋友學校的制度幾好，跟得上現時社會的需要。我小兒現在的學校在家長溝通上好像沒有進步。雖然學校提供了一人一電腦，但由始致終沒有提供如何使家長便易和老師溝通。好像今次的例子，我在學校網頁上找到老師的電郵，發了信，沒有回覆。小兒給我老師的電郵，發了信，也是沒有回覆。學校從來沒有給家長老師的電郵，真落後！或許有人說為什麼不向學校取，但是我會問為什麼這般間接，我們的距離是那麼遠嗎？
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-22 13:47
平常跟老師溝通，我也是從學校網址的gateway上找到的，如果不大肯定是特定的負責老師，會另外cc給tutorteacher 或year head teacher. 若久未回音，會特意向head teacher再問的。
制度是死，溝通是活！偶爾看到不認識的老師或孩子有好消息，例如五十多歲的男老師去打慈善拳，法文老師跑100k世界賽, 排名十九，十一歳女孩參加三鐵籌款等，我會毫不怕醜的寫個電郵恭賀一番，那怕他們唔知我是物水！
補充是五年前那位mentor初來埗到，帶點害羞，少言，當初幾乎想把他「叮走」，背後又被我講番幾句壞話（很記得做過), 后來才明白有些人不大懂應付大人，對孩子卻另有板釜，結果是銅幣有兩面了。
初中的家長特別容易茫然，其中原因是我們容易把小學的習慣套進中學裡。西方教育特別鼓勵孩子作主導，孩子有意見問老師，老師特別欣賞，亦喜把通知交孩子處理。高中情況尤甚。他們習慣了便處理無誤了。
小女去英國讀中六，除了第一封錄取恭賀信是給父母的。其他電郵來往，文件申請，visa事宜，完全是孩子和學校的交往，有問題由阿女問。擺明是「飛甩我」，明既，即「閃」！
作者: Ruby1219 時間: 14-6-22 15:27 標題: 引用：平常跟老師溝通，我也是從學校網址的gatewa
原帖由 annie40 於 14-06-22 發表
平常跟老師溝通，我也是從學校網址的gateway上找到的，如果不大肯定是特定的負責老師，會另外cc給tutorteac ...
1. 有些好的老師很會跟小朋友溝通，但不太懂或不太喜歡和家長交流。 (我仔仔的english tutor 就係呢類，仔仔好鍾意佢，佢亦教得好好，但對住我時就好似吾多想講野).
若果一定要我取捨，我寧願要這種老師，好過那些懂得取悅家長但不懂或不用心教小朋友的老師。
2. 學校/老師真係prefer 小朋友直接同佢地溝通。 以我仔考英國學校經驗，我send email 學校都會一兩日答覆，但若果係阿仔send, 佢地好快覆，同埋言語上好欣賞同鼓勵佢。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-22 15:53
小兒有發電郵及親口問老師，但小兒絕對不同意因為他有功課有不小心及錯誤的地方而導致低份。所以我很想問老師發生了什麼事，就是這麼簡單的問題，為什麼得不到答案！
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-22 17:54
keep checking with language dept then
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-23 10:43
I think there should be appeal system in ESF which allow students or parents to discuss academic issue at the end of year. Parent -teacher meeting should be held twice so that parents can approach teachers and ask questions.
作者: Mighty 時間: 14-6-23 11:37
CHOISUM、以上有否同学校反応過？我過去在小学校就提議過３次、覚得PARENT－TEACHER CONFERENCE不足、CONFERENCE毎次見也只是１５分鐘MAX。 没結果、但当然希望毎位家長都可以同学校発声、希望有一天他門会聴到。
説回這個CASE、不如直接打電話去問下LA, but this week is already the last week, the teacher might have left for holidays la. Even so, you should check with him when he comes back. 絶不ENCOURAGE HELICOPTER PARENT,所以最好由仔仔FOLLOW UP先、到最後才自己出馬。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-23 11:51
回覆 Mighty 的帖子
仔仔已發了聲。我不是Helicopter parent.只是這一科老師特別奇怪，我才跟進。加上他下年走了，沒有機會再問老師。我覺得雖然可能是小事，但大大發現學校的溝通問題。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-24 09:38
I sent email to school office to confirm the teacher's email addresses in case I might send to wrong email addresses. After two days, no reply from school office. So....
作者: oooray 時間: 14-6-24 09:59
學校跟政府或商業機構一樣；politics come first. 官官相謂。
別說小朋友不能挑戰(即使道理在你方)校方；就算家長披甲上陣；慘勝已是萬幸。
反正你小朋友會在新學校展開新一頁；安心放暑假吧!
當今天買個教訓；將來不再踩同樣地雷。
你用你的私人時間與他們的工作時間鬥；不划算。
要麼氣難下；明天直接找校長緊急理論；討回公道；至少給該老師一點不大不小的麻煩；反正你已選擇離開。否則暑假後你只是一個舊生家長；一切俱往矣!
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-24 10:40
其實學校本身以前是政府支助，多少有政府作風。很多家長提出意見，學校都沒有接受。現在的校長，我有直接提建議，但他好像不明白。從前的校長可以用電郵對話，可惜ESF不同他續約。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-24 12:07
回覆 oooray 的帖子
多謝你的意見，我不是氣憤，但覺得寫了出來，ESF的家長可以作參考。我不是針對個人，只是制度應有改善的空間。我還有很多家長朋友，不想有同類問題發生。
作者: oooray 時間: 14-6-24 12:19
回覆 Choisumwong 的帖子
有幸見識過另一學校(費事開名)；為左一d好簡單的事情一級一級上去一直拖拖拉拉；盡力河蟹；最後要坐係校長室面對面傾先至有答案。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-24 12:49
回覆 oooray 的帖子
如果只是小事，誰想煩校長。但小兒小學時真的需要去到校長才能解決。我覺得中層老師最不想面對家長。小女和小兒的問題（非學術性）處理不好，多是管理層的老師。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-24 19:28
既然老師不想回覆，算了吧。Case closed.
作者: maymycheung 時間: 14-6-25 23:47
May I ask which ESF is yr boy studying？
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-26 09:44
回覆 maymycheung 的帖子
算吧，我不想說，學校大部份的老師都沒有問題。
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-26 14:52
如果只是小事，誰想煩校長。但小兒小學時真的需要去到校長才能解決。我覺得中層老師最不想面對家長。小女和小兒的問題（非學術性）處理不好，多是管理層的老師。
**** ****
哈哈, 我第一次煩中学校長次是投诉学校的成绩表印刷粗糙, (小学部的成绩报告精美多呢!), 完全未能体谅学生们用心读书的努力, 敬希文书部重视和改进........系咪有点低智呢?
经过几年, 自我完善, 改进一点, 唔会再比较!
校長好快甘话会考虑和改进云云...............无丙我!
作者: annie40 時間: 14-6-26 15:07
大家唔好讲到间学校是'门高狗大', 只要合理合礼的也可直接当面讲, 唔讲就永远唔知答案. 会抑郁!
如果是自己错, 比人教训是应该, 如果是老师错, 提醒让他改进也好事.对事不对人, 有料的鬼老无甘少气! 没料子的才怕比你catch.到
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-26 16:51
小兒小學時被鬼仔bully，學校的老師偏幫鬼仔，過了一、兩個月都沒有改善。最終看到小兒身上有傷痕及有證人，才報警求助。事件到了校長那裏，他問我可不可以給他處理，我說沒有問題，但他要保證我小兒不再受影響。結果小兒再沒有被bully。學習上可以發揮所長，享受中、小學的日子。
除非小兒解決不了，我才會幫手 。學校成績的一點汚點，原諒老師吧！
作者: joys2334 時間: 14-6-28 12:45
之前認識一個A*的小朋友, very outstanding one, 有一科學科個老師比個C佢, 因為佢上課的classroom behaviour 唔係咁好, 不過你個CASE 可能是老師搞錯卽, 同埋真係有一二個老師係唔係好識用電腦的......
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-28 17:29
100% sure my son got the wrong grade because the last term report released on 26th June showed As. Anyway, I will accept some teachers don't know how to use computer but not accept no reply.
作者: Artie 時間: 14-6-28 20:12
我仔女讀 rchk ，應該大家的 system 都是一樣 (gateway)，我地冇遇過 d 分數有問題；我和仔女老師聯絡也是經 email，未試過有老師唔覆，部份會很快覆，試過有老師夜晚 10 點都看 email 覆 email，亦有部份只會在工作時間內處理家長的 email。
我覺得樓主的情形，是個別老師的問題，不是 esf 的 system 有問題，一樣米樣百樣人，有些老師較積極，有些就冇咁有熱誠；但如果老師唔回覆家長冇責任心，我覺得這老師就不對，家長應盡快向學校反映，不能對他太包容。如果是我，等了三天都冇回覆，我會將 email，forward 去 head of year 或 head of language，等他們處理。
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-6-29 10:50
回覆 Artie 的帖子
Thanks for your opinion. The fact is the teacher is the senior leader of the school. The head of year or head of language is under him. I have the impression that your kid's school is better run and parents' approch to teachers is more easy. I actually encountered many difficulties with school communication. Never mind, no more communication.
作者: Choisumwong 時間: 14-7-3 20:45
真相是阿仔的同學有同樣的問題，他父母直接向校長反映，問題不久就解決了。而我不想煩校長，結果是老師不回答，問題不了了之。我提議英基的父母，無論有什麼問題，最好問校長，不要比面老師！否則後果自負！
作者: annie40 時間: 14-7-4 20:36
來去只是某一位老師聯絡不上吧！
我的經驗跟Artie的差不多，完全未遇過「不回复」個案。
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