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標題: UK schools are swamped by Chinese students [打印本頁]

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-22 00:16 標題: UK schools are swamped by Chinese students

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-22 00:16 編輯

I have just read in an UK education forum that Roedean School's nickname is "Beijing High" and it is described as "essentially an all Chinese math/science factory". This girl in the Sixth form said only one in eight of the girls in Six Form are English/American. For the same reason, Cheltenham Ladies College is called "Hong Kong College". Schools in UK are now increasingly swamped by students from PRC/HK. What do you think of this trend? I mean even in the International Schools in Hong Kong, you won't find so many Chinese students or at least not at such a high ratio.

作者: mrshoho 時間: 12-3-22 00:33 標題: 回覆：UK schools are swamped by Chinese students

I think nothing after reading this, why don't u share your thoughts?

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-22 03:12

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-22 03:19 編輯

I am considering the idea of sending my kids to UK to study. But I now realise that there are some UK schools where 90% of the students are Chinese. Even in top schools like CLC, I heard that they also have a large number of Chinese students. Some people are saying that when you have so many Chinese students in a school, they often talk to each other in Chinese and sometimes they don't even interact with the English students. So I am thinking if there is really a lot of difference between sending my kids to UK or asking them to finish their study in HK. Can parents tell me the pros and cons of studying in UK as opposed to studing in an IS in HK?

作者: mrshoho 時間: 12-3-22 09:09

I see this happening every where, not just in the UK.

作者: Arcana 時間: 12-3-22 09:39

If you think the only reason of studying overseas is to learn English, there is no point in studying there based on the fact.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-22 10:05

Arcana 發表於 12-3-22 09:39
If you think the only reason of studying overseas is to learn English, there is no point in studying ...

I don't think the only reason of studying overseas is to learn English because you can do it in HK's IS.

作者: caa 時間: 12-3-22 10:23

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I think sending children overseas is a very big decision, so both parents and the children should personally visit the schools and have a real look, not just based on hearsay.

作者: Arcana 時間: 12-3-22 10:51

本帖最後由 Arcana 於 12-3-22 10:52 編輯

bobbycheung 發表於 12-3-22 10:05
I don't think the only reason of studying overseas is to learn English because you can do it in HK's ...

That’s the point. If you think learning English is not the only reason of studying overseas, “UK schools are swamped by Chinese students” would not be your concern.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-22 11:14

Can parents tell me the pros and cons of studying in UK as opposed to studing in an IS in HK?

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-22 11:19

caa 發表於 12-3-22 10:23
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I think sending children overseas is a very big decision, so both parents a ...

Yes, you are right. I don't know what actually happened at Roedean, but I know a CLC student who said to me that there are a large number of Chinese/HK girls there. Can parents tell me how many Chinese students there are in your kids' UK schools?

作者: caa 時間: 12-3-22 12:24

bobbycheung 發表於 12-3-22 11:19
Yes, you are right. I don't know what actually happened at Roedean, but I know a CLC student who sa ...

I think you better check and verify with the schools you aim at.

作者: Mighty 時間: 12-3-22 13:41

Chinese people are everywhere. So you cannot avoid it. But may be if you choose a less famous school in a small town in U.K., then there might be less Chinese. One con that I can think of is you dont see your child so often is he/she is overseas.

作者: powerpuff 時間: 12-3-23 02:35 標題: 引用：+本帖最後由+bobbycheung+於+12-3-22+00:16

原帖由 bobbycheung 於 12-03-22 發表
本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-22 00:16 編輯

I have just read in an UK education forum that Roede ...

個個都是找那幾間agents, 參加同樣的教育展，介紹的都是那幾所＂名校＂，到入學當然有很多同道人啦！

作者: FattyDaddy 時間: 12-3-23 06:28

When I went to a boarding school in UK almost 40 years ago, there were only 8 ethnic Chinese students (4 from Hongkong plus 4 from Singapore and Malaysia) out of a total of 300 across all the years, and guess what, "they often talk to each other in Chinese and sometimes they don't even interact with the English students".

Swamped or not swamped, the behaviour is the same

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-23 08:46

FattyDaddy 發表於 12-3-23 06:28
When I went to a boarding school in UK almost 40 years ago, there were only 8 ethnic Chinese student ...

In that case, the situation now is in fact better your old days because one could at least learn better Chinese language when one is surrounded by hundreds of ethnic Chinese students.

Seriously, I have just read Annie40's another thread referring to 賈安娜's article on this topic.
http://www.edu-kingdom.com/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=2278090

It's said there that sending a kid overseas to study in the hope that he will learn and become independent is not really a legitimate reason.

We see a lot of IS students going overseas each year. What are the pros of doing so?

作者: Choisumwong 時間: 12-3-23 12:37

After reading the content of discussion, what is true is that many able students are looking for top schools in UK. A large number of Chinese in CLC is misleading. Chinese students speak Chinese is not a shame in UK schools. Chinese students in top schools require good English level to be admitted. Top schools in UK are better than so-call international schools in Hong Kong in terms of teacher-to-student ratio, school facilities, student activities, academic level and top university admission.

作者: caa 時間: 12-3-23 13:16

Choisumwong 發表於 12-3-23 12:37
After reading the content of discussion, what is true is that many able students are looking for top ...

Can't agree more

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-23 13:43

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-23 18:41 編輯

Choisumwong 發表於 12-3-23 12:37
After reading the content of discussion, what is true is that many able students are looking for top ...

May I know the ratio of Chinese students in CLC? I did not say that Chinese students speaking Chinese in UK schools is a shame. It is just that if my kids go to UK, I would hope that they would mix well with English students (and students of other nationalities) as well and not to form a group exclusively amongst the Chinese themselves. In schools such as Roedean where the majority is Chinese students, perhaps it is difficult to do so. Could parents tell us what is the ratio of Chinese students in other UK schools?

Regarding the issue of top university admission, I have also done a little bit of research. I looked at Westminster school where it had 90 out of a total of 189 students going to Oxbridge in 2010. With a figure of 47.6%, Westminster is probably the top school in UK. However, when I looked at the degree subjects they chose to do in universities, I found that out of the 189 students, 4 did Architecture, 6 did economics, 2 did Law and 8 did Medicine. So there were only 20 odd students taking these so called "popular degree courses" and remember they didn't all do the subjects at Oxbridge. The same happens at Wycombe Abbey. 25 out of a total of 64 students (ie. 39%) went to Oxbridge for 2009-2010. Out of these 25 "Oxbridge" students, 1 did Law and 3 did Medicine. In CLC, 13 out of a total of 126 students (ie. 10%) went to Oxbridge in 2010. I couldn't find any details as to the subject courses they took. I could only suspect that CLC's situation is similar. I am not in any way saying or implying that these results are no good. In fact, if we are aiming to go to Oxbridge (and doing whatever subject courses it takes to get in), then these schools will probably give you the best shot. However, if you are aiming to do Law, Economics, Architecture and Medicine etc., the chance is that you will probably do it in Bristol U, UCL, Warwick U and LSE etc. (and all of them are good universities) which, I believe, is not totally beyond the reach of the kids who study in IS in HK. I might be completely wrong and I would like to hear parents' views.

作者: seasamestreet 時間: 12-3-23 14:52

We were live in a small city a year ago, my son's school have 4 chinese students, two of them are sibling, one is half british half Malaysia, my son is half chinese too.

作者: Choisumwong 時間: 12-3-23 18:46

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I think oversea students in CLC is about 10-20%. Chinese/asian students, according to my information, occupy about 10%.
Top schools will have their own policy to make sure their oversea students will mix well with other local students.
Target on top university not just applies to UK, but also USA. It should be subjuct-based. Students in oversea will be encouraged by teachers and friends to take subjects they like and enjoy for whole life , not just law and medicine like in HK.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-23 19:08

I have just looked at St. Paul's Girls' School which is supposed to the only UK school having an Oxbridge admission rate higher than Westminster School during the period from 2007 to 2009. For 2011, it had 36 students going to Oxbridge out of a total of 87 students. The percentage is 41%. Out of these 36 "Oxbridge" students, 2 did Law and 2 did Medicine. It kind of confirms that the chance of getting into Oxbridge to do Law and Medicine etc. is pretty slim even for the very top UK schools like these. Of course, I can't rule out the possibility that students in these top UK schools don't like to take Law and Medicine etc and they only like to take History and English etc. in universities.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-23 19:19

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-23 19:20 編輯

Choisumwong 發表於 12-3-23 18:46
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I think oversea students in CLC is about 10-20%. Chinese/asian students, ac ...

I am not saying students should only try for Law and Medicine etc. Of course, they should do what they like. (When I looked at the lists, I see degree coureses that I can't even dream of doing.) Anyway, as with subjects, students may not even aim at the "top" universities. Some may even choose universities based on their location rather than anything else. What I am saying is that for HK students who aim to do Law and Medicine etc, the difference between going to UK to study as opposed to studying in IS in HK might not be as great as one would imagine because the universities they ultimately go to may well be the same. I note there are people from these UK schools going to US, but they are really the minority.

作者: panala 時間: 12-3-23 22:33

Arcana 發表於 12-3-22 09:39
If you think the only reason of studying overseas is to learn English, there is no point in studying ...

can't agree more

作者: caa 時間: 12-3-24 09:16

bobbycheung 發表於 12-3-23 19:08
I have just looked at St. Paul's Girls' School which is supposed to the only UK school having an Oxb ...

If statistics is a major factor and your focus or personal preference is subject based like law or medicine or architecture etc "practical" disciplines, I believe HKU, CU or other uni in HK may just be fine. And to enter local uni, I think some 地區名校 not necessarily traditional famous schools in HK have high admission rates, ie good statistics in recent years.

作者: caa 時間: 12-3-24 09:18

caa 發表於 12-3-24 09:16
If statistics is a major factor and your focus or personal preference is subject based like law or m ...

Sorry I mean HKU, CU etc are not only just fine, they are very good.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-24 09:58

caa 發表於 12-3-24 09:16
If statistics is a major factor and your focus or personal preference is subject based like law or m ...

Thanks for your advice. Let's go back and focus on the pros and cons of going overseas. I know the cons such as the kids will have to be separated from their families members and the high school fees. The pros are that the kids will have more exposure to the outside world and they will learn how to be independent. Choisumwong also said that "top schools in UK are better than so-call international schools in Hong Kong in terms of teacher-to-student ratio, school facilities, student activities, academic level and top university admission." Any other pros that I have missed out?

作者: IJai 時間: 12-3-27 01:38

I graduated from Roedean back in 1986. I was the only girl from HK in the whole form ^^

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-27 11:19

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-27 11:50 編輯

IJai 發表於 12-3-27 01:38
I graduated from Roedean back in 1986. I was the only girl from HK in the whole form ^^

I understand that Roedean was one of the best in your days, but apparently a lot has changed since then. Please read this.
http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?p=35860715&highlight=roedean
(PS. No offence meant)

作者: raymonds 時間: 12-3-28 17:16

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If you are so interested in statistic figure of admission to Oxbridge and Law/Medicine degree, look at this school.

http://www.concordcollegeuk.com/default.asp?page=44&news=384

They got a very impressive Oxbridge record this year - 18 total!!! Beating many schools you mentioned!!!

作者: caa 時間: 12-3-28 17:56

raymonds 發表於 12-3-28 17:16
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If you are so interested in statistic figure of admission to Oxbridge and L ...

Wow just looked at this school's website. It says students work incredibly hard to achieve not only their hopes and dreams but also hopes and dreams of their family!
Education is not just about results (esp in terms of what college or uni or subject you eventually go to) right? I can't imagine nowadays our children are still expected to achieve parents' own hopes.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-28 19:21

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-3-28 23:43 編輯

raymonds 發表於 12-3-28 17:16
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If you are so interested in statistic figure of admission to Oxbridge and L ...

Out of the 4 school that I mentioned (ie. Westminster school, Wycombe Abbey, CLC and St. Paul's Girls' School), I am afraid Concord College's record of 18 students could only beat CLC's record of 13.  But then we will have to look at the percentage as well.  It seems that Concord College has more students in Upper Sixth than CLC and it works out that the percentage of students going to Oxbridge is about the same for both schools ie. 10%.  To avoid any misunderstanding, I am not saying Concord College is no good or in any way not good enough.

I notice something interesting about Concord College.  Its website says that "the Sixth Form is its largest part, roughly 75%".  Its Lower School only comprises 25% of the college.  I could only imagine that it takes in a lot of new students in the Sixth Form.  Looking at the list of students going to Oxbridge, I found that all of them have a foreign name.  Could it be that they are all top foreign students who joined Concord College in the Sixth Form?  I don't know.  Another thing is that the subjects they take at Oxbridge resemble the subjects that are generally "popular" to the Asian.  If you compare them with those of the 4 schools I mentioned, you will know what I mean.

By the way, I am not saying that these Oxbridge figures are the be all and end all.  In fact, I think they should always be looked at in the light of the subjects these people take.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-3-28 19:32

caa 發表於 12-3-28 17:56
Wow just looked at this school's website. It says students work incredibly hard to achieve not only ...

Of course, kids are expected to achieve their parents' own dreams! Who pays for the tution fees?

No pay, no say!

作者: 4eyesDad 時間: 12-3-31 22:04

I heard that the legal and medical professions in Hong Kong have made it very hard for those who are non-local university graduates to practise in those two professions. Following the practical approach advocated by some contributors here, this must be one of the cons to consider. I have even heard to my astonishment that some HK students in UK boarding schools have forgone the offer from Cambridge to read medicine and have returned to HK for a local medicine degree instead.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-4-1 00:59

本帖最後由 bobbycheung 於 12-4-1 01:03 編輯

4eyesDad 發表於 12-3-31 22:04
I heard that the legal and medical professions in Hong Kong have made it very hard for those who are ...

I don't know anything about the medical profession. But I understand that one could do a law degree in a UK university and then come back to HK to do the PCLL.

作者: 4eyesDad 時間: 12-4-1 08:52

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I heard there will be some kind PCLL quota for non-local law graduates. It is a daunting prospect that all oversea law graduates will have to compete against each other for very limited PCLL places. It follows that if you have a first class honours law degree from Cambridge, your chance of getting a PCLL place will be very good. On the other hand, if you have a lower second class honours law degree, you don't have much of a chance - even your degree is from Cambridge!

作者: poonseelai 時間: 12-4-1 10:21

If one want to practice in HK, surely I would choose to study medicine in HK Us. It would be almost impossible for graduates of overseas Us to practice in HK. If u still remember how difficult it was just to hire a few overseas doctors to work in gov't hospitals got a ver short time. Interestingly some doctors rejecting the ideas of temporary hiring of overseas doctors actually studied overseas prior to 1997.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-4-1 10:39

I see. What about medicine?

作者: nintendo 時間: 12-4-1 12:00

本帖最後由 nintendo 於 12-4-1 12:01 編輯

Go to websites like jobsdb.com and have a look at the legal section. A lot of companies are hiring "LLB graduates" to do paralegal work. It might indeed be that there are quite some LLB graduates now in Hong Kong who cannot get PCLL place and have to do work which previously not done by law graduates.

作者: bobbycheung 時間: 12-4-1 14:59

I googled and found that for HKU's LLB, the intake quota is 86. Around 15 % to 20% of the total places will be allocated for non-JUPAS candidates. Does anybody know PCLL's quota for overseas students?

作者: nintendo 時間: 12-4-10 16:52

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I would like to know how they allocate the places for PCLL too.

作者: webeheld 時間: 12-4-10 19:59

Hmm...I spot a really awesome school mentioned above.
I applied to that school but did not get in. The reason? They only accept ONE student from HK in order to avoid turning their school into an Asian camp, in the case such as Harrow...Dulwich...Roedean etc. (I lost the place to a DGS girl lol)
So...not all famous schools are that flooded with Asians. Even if so, some still really excel as a school on the whole, such as Concord College.

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